Is the world of academia that full of backstabbing and nasty politics

Yes

Is there still hope for a hard-worker with a passion for their subject?

Yes

I think the biggest thing people don't tell you is the poor career prospects.

About 60% of people who actually finish their PhD do NOT end up in academia. Yet employers rarely see the value in employing PhDs (and some even view them as undesirable).

Those that manage to make it in academia are on short term contracts and are not very well paid compared to other professions. They are highly pressured environments with lots of politics and backbiting and the whole scene is very Darwinian.

Enjoy your time as a PhD student, as its probably the best time in an academic career.

Does anyone else bemoan the fact that a career in academia means that you can't actually participate in a lot of modern life.

Jeez over half a decade of higher education and we are living worse than shelf stackers...

From the experiences of my friends who made the jump to industry the "best" time is either straight after your PhD or in a period of 1-2 years post PhD (but with some industry experience during that time).

If your industry is competitive, I would highly recommend you get some real world work experience, even low level. Quite often you are going to be competing against undergrads and MSc students, who may not have the same academic background but are more commercially savvy and have internships and placement years.

Even if you take the postdoc, make sure you have SOMETHING else work related on your CV to talk about at interviews.

Nope. Not at all.

I am currently on a roll and I am getting an AVERAGE knockback rate of about 5 submissions before acceptance (some more, some less, but never first time). I take it as part of the process to write, listen to the comments and redraft. Though it hurts and is annoying, the papers DO get better because of this.

I am now in a position where I am "signing off" papers from the other team members before they submit to journals. One of the other two postdocs have only published 1 article since completing his thesis, and has had this second paper (from his thesis) rejected 8 times already. Its good work, but its very niche, so he has to try lots of places.

My advice is to sit down with someone objective and go through it. Is the work good, or are you being knocked back because of the natural rejection rate. Think of it like dating, you expect to go on lots of dates before you find your spouse right?

But Smildon, you've come from a place where there was no freedom (business) to having some freedom (current academia), so of course its going to feel more free for you.

However, those of us who have an idea of what it used to be like knows how much freedom has been lost. And to what gain? Our research has not gotten further, or we aren't more respected etc etc. In fact we have MORE undergrads to teach but fewer resources comparatively. We have lost a lot of freedom and gained very little if anything in return.

This is so disingenious it is funny!

Um, most of my GP friends do not find their work "well paid tedium" but are very happy to help a huge number of people every day. I daresay they make a greater contribution to society than Tim Birkhead.

Also I wonder what sort of university it is that he works at where they are able to reject business mode? And an academic job WITHOUT some grind is unbelievable. Who does his fact checking, editing and proofreading? Also I laugh at the idea of academics "pursuing truth" when there is a multiplicity of realities and possible truths to negotiate.

However, if that genuinely is his job, then I would love it. Shame it doesnt resemble mine.

I think a more viable explanation is that you called them on their "mistake" and they are getting stroppy at being caught out.

Presumably because you didn't act all compliant and "oh of course you can do what you want with me" they arent used to dealing with it. It is a shame because if more people like you stood up for themselves the higher ups would realise they cant get away with taking liberties with their subordinates.

Pineapple, you can rest easy knowing you did the right thing in standing up for yourself, its not your fault they are acting so childishly.

I think Pineapple is right to feel angry, as this is a really common backstabbing technique. There have been many times where an author has been bumped off the author list of a publication and then pacified with "It was a mistake, dont worry you will be on the next one". Pineapple is at a stage in her career where she needs every publication and authorship for her future.

I think you should push to get your work recognised, because it seems no one else is defending your corner.

"BH - have you read 'the rise of the meritocracy' -quite an interesting book which I am using as part of my section on labour power"

Yes, I managed to track down a second hand copy and I love it. (Puts way too much faith in psychologists abilities to select though). I do see the dangers of consolidating the view that those who achieve do, whilst those that dont flounder, but at my fairly puny level I have to motivate people too (they are all quite ambitious, but require some coaxing).

@ Olivia: Fair point, and I would give everyone the best gear if I could. I try to operate a first dibs principle for achievers rather than deprive anyone (for the basics at least).

@LostinOz: I would be very concerned for your mental health if you stayed at the bottom of the ladder for over a year. Its going to play havoc for your self esteem, and may even lead you to start believing that you really are in some way worse than them (When you arent). Remember people tend to transmit their own pressure downwards, so you could end up carrying a lot of crap that belongs to your entire group.

I got this in my few months temping and I still feel intense rage at the assholes that lorded it over me back then.

I agree with Matt.

Your PhD years can be seen as "working in research", and you can highlight the benchskills/maths/ critical analytical tools you learned during this period to other employers.

Looking back on my own thesis, I feel that the PhD was made out to me as the holy grail (too hyped and over rated), but its actually skills I am learning NOW that are more important.

You need to address this issue quickly, as there is a natural pecking order in any group within a pressured environment. People dont really talk about it and will probably deny it happens even. It is the same in all groups, and I guess no one wants to be that person last on the email list, the person that gets the worst supervision slots and whose suggestions are continually overlooked at meetings.

I think the longer you spend at the end of the list the harder it is to get off from it. Perhaps it could be helpful to see who previously took this spot, and see how they rose from it?

I think you raise a very important, often overlooked point- The issue of favouritism.

In my lab, I have started to run things like a meritocracy where those that achieve are given praise, conference money and first choice of new equipment. Ideally there would be enough for everyone, but there isnt. I figure this way is better than the old way of "Whoever sucks up wins".

I guess in this situation the best way to "get back on top" will be to show results. That may be an accepted publication in a high impact journal, it may be developing a new way to do something that makes it more efficient, or just being seen to go that extra mile (coordinating a conference, running a journal club). In short you "make" yourself more important.

Perhaps all the hardcore members can quit the forum and leave it so its just a wasteland of "PLEAZE GET ME PHD AND FUNDIN" and "Ooh, poor you, I feel your pain, lets group hug".

The hardcore members are what keep this board real. If they left it would resemble genuine PhD-dom in the way Star Wars resembles the life of real astronauts.