My boyfriend hates that woman., not only is she obsessed with peoples poo, but also because she seemed to buy her PhD...Did you notice, she has now stopped using 'Doctor' on all her books etc and seems to not be the diet guru for chanel 4 any more?

Might be an amusing thing to say at a dinner party one day... 'Oh, so you have a PhD?; ... 'Yeah, bought it off the internet'...

I would have thought that it would be more constructive to suggest that she has a nice night with her friends and calms down.. than to just say 'Hope it all works out'... PhD, industry, 18 or 80.. everyone gets stressed, it's part of being human ...

*However* how you deal with that stress can be the difference between someone treating you with compassion and someone treating you with no respect at all - I've had strops, I've had stresses and I can sympathise - but I personally would rather Lara finish her PhD (which I am sure she is capable of) than writing emotive emails to people and then regretting it....

Cup of tea, long walk, whatever.. to calm down - and THEN reassess the situation...

I can understand you are very stressed right now, but chill out - I hate to say it, but some of your posts come across in quite a childish way and that's not meant to be offensive, as I can be really childish at times.. but things like

'phds are for people that are clever. i'm not. so i quit' is a pile of horse crap and it just sounds like you're throwing your toys out the pram.. you've come so far, don't let your moron supervisor wear you down.. call your friends, have a nice night and work out a plan of action.

By getting stroppy and acting in an unprofessional manner, you're just giving weight to your supervisors cticisms... PhD's aren't for clever people, they're for people who don't quit when all the mundane tasks need doing and for people who can keep going, even when criticised...

'I don't think I can face a career in academia. The politics/bulls**t/backstabbing does my head in'

That's why I want to go *back* to academia.. as the backstabbing and politics in industry are going my head in..

If you want to go for a job or career, go for it.. just don't expect the grass to be greener on the other side!

I always informed my supervisor, 'I am on holiday from HERE to HERE' and that was that.

I'm interested how she tries to talk you out of it? surely you need to use this as an experience of how to say 'no'? perhaps a white lie 'No, it's a family members wedding / family holiday' etc.. something that you *can't* change....

I'd personally just say 'No, I'm having a holiday' but I appreciate it's not alwyas that easy...

I was 21 when I started mine... hoped to have finished by the time I was 24... sadly I'll be 26 when I graduate (in 2 weeks)...

Amusingly I still get people calling me 'fake' as apparantly 'you can't get a PhD at your age ' and 'You can't go straight from a BSc to a PhD' ..

.. cretins..

'In the UK there is no grading'

Indeed.. whether you pass with minor corrections or major corrections it makes no difference as your degree certificate will just have 'PhD' on it...

You either get the degree or you don't...

First year - Pub, back home by 4:00pm to watch random TV shows
Second year - realise I need to do some work, Pub, back by 5:00pm to watch random TV shows
Third year - job hunting as grant runs out this year, writing up, pub but only for a few hours a night...
Fourth year - hell on earth as editing thesis and working full time away from home... realise that pub was fun but probably not the best idea for 3 years..

'since we had frequent meetings despite the fact that those were spent with her chatting about non-PhD related things most of the time'

I'd say this was both your and her fault, you need to be more disciplined and see your supervisor as a supervisor, not a confidant or friend and she needs to not go off on tangents. I spoke to my supervisor about random stuff, but ONLY when we had got the PhD things out the way. If you're emotional, think about what you're going to say, before you say it... rather than going on the agressive and say ' You're a crap supervisor' in a guise... say 'Ok, if you agree on what the other person said... HOW would YOU suggest I improve?' and if she's vague, ask 'Could you give me an example please?'

Don't take crap, but don't accuse her of being crap - arse kissing goes on and if your supervisor is the type to backstab you to further themselves, make sure you don't tell them anything you don't need to.

I didn't do one.. went straight from BSc to PhD!

So, you have someone with a BSc and 3-4 years of experience and someone with a PhD and 6 months experience... who would /should the Universty choose as the sessional lecturer? the person who can apply industry experience to the lecturing subject but doesn't have the research experience.. or the person who mainly knows 'theoretically' about stuff but hasn't necessarily experienced it?

'Has to be 'them' undervaluing surely? Can't be 'us' overvaluing, as £30K (as previously stated) isn't a lot of money in this day and age (is it)?'

Ahh healthy debate, how I love thee when I am supposed to be working... I would say, you could live on £15K a year for the rest of your life if your wages went up with inflation. Could you live 'well', well although that's subjective I would say no.. as you couldn't afford to buy a house, many of lifes luxuries would be unaffordable..

So £30K, to me.. (and perhaps others?) seems like a lot of money - maybe that's just because I lived on a student grant for 3 years and topped it up with lab practicals and exam moderation? Would I like to be on £30K in 5 years time? hell no... hence why I brought age into it as well...

Do you think... that PhD students have an unrealistic idea of what they are going to get paid when the finish? I'm just wondering and this isn't directed at anyone in particular? I'm not saying it's *fair* to pay a PhD student the same as a BSc student in non-academia, but life isn't fair and it happens as companies don't always care about your degrees past the BSc...

I just find that some of my chums who have just undertaken a PhD or are half way through, think that once they have this mystical, magical peice of paper.. that you're going to get a lot of cash.. quickly....

When in reality, that's not necessarily the case.

In which case.. DOES the UK (and any other country you guys know about) undervalue a PhD...or does the PhD student overvalue their worth?

'Most of us wouldn't but how often does that happen. Most starting salaries (I'm informed) are much lower.'

I was looking at jobs.ac.uk and RA's are lower but the Computer Science lecturing jobs for a junior lecturer start at about £30K upwards...

Jouri, I am on less that £30K now and have been working 2 years in industry... so I would *love* to 'have a pay increase' to that! I think the average salary in the UK is about £23-£24K isn't it? so for me, I'd be just happy to be earning enough to cover bills and save up a bit of cash for a rainy day!

Maybe it depends on personal things? how old you are, the experiences you have, the nature of your PhD, the industry it's in?

"Since academics are relatively undervalued, underpaid and overworked in the UK"

Depends what Uni... I can't say I would have a problem with 30K plus as a starting salary and a final salary pension considering they are so rare....

My friend is an academic at a UK university and mostly 'works from home' (read: does bugger all)...