Christ, mulleted one (sorry, that's one of the only bad hair cuts I can think of other than mine), you really need a laugh then :-) Let's not get embittered and defeatist about things. If you want that, I recommend you start posting on the Daily Mail website and join the Country Is Going To Crap Club. Unless we're a population of masochists, why the hell bother with it? Why doesn't everyone that wants this career that is so evil, demoralising, demotivating, soul-destroying, just stop what they're doing, join you in the dole queue and have a defeatist, self-flagellating orgy? I suppose you being so omniscient about matters (though they're based on your relative experiences and personality), I may as well just stop entertaining ideas of success, put my pen down, shrug my shoulders and utter "oh well, I'll drop out tomorrow". If it's as utterly shit (sorry) as you say, there's not much point is there? Time to start learning Klingon instead methinks because you've put a dirty great crap stain on the CV I was going to develop and use for my future career. I'm glad my internal organs don't share your view of future prospects because they may as well pack in now. And thanks for the 'insider' information telling me exactly what it's going to like, because in my ignorance and naivety of trying to emphasise what I think could be positive about a post-phd career to spur myself on, I really didn't know what's expected. For the first time I believe I can use the words 'objective', 'perspective' and 'misery' in the same sentence. (up)

Nope, no sepia-tinted glasses here. I've done lots of different jobs before I ever ended up doing what I am now - warehouse, picking and packing, call centre, supermarket, off licence. I am enjoyed them all (apart from the crappy call centre and thieves in the off licence). There's nothing naive about what I'm saying. If it wasn't worth it, it wouldn't be so hard and competitive. And look where I've gotten so far? Maybe I won't get anything after I've finished my PhD, but sod it, that's not something to worry about too much in the midst of study - it's very self-defeating. The purpose of this thread is to identify the positives, of which there are more than negatives - everyone on this forum is testament to that. Now, I know what I say may be saccharine enough to send a diabetic into a coma, but, there is an awful lot of value in doing a PhD for future career potential. Famous last words? I hope not. If so, career as a charlatan motivational speaker methinks. :-)

Oh, have a star, by the way(up)

No, I think you're being realistic, WJ-Gibson. However, to think that what I do would never get me what I want would be very counter-productive at this moment in time. What I can say is that, statistically speaking, I'm much more likely to end up doing what I want to do, if I do what I need to do. Unfortunately, like yourself, I can't predict the future or what is around the corner. What I can do, is remind myself of why it is worthwhile, what good could come of it and therefore, motivate myself, increase my chances of passing and have a successful career in academia.:-)

I think, at times, there is a lot of negativity about doing a PhD. Threads have been posted in the past to counter this, such as things you really enjoy about doing your PhD. I like my PhD when I think about it, though it is, at times, very tough and pushes me to the edge of my limited capabilities. I was sat on the trai today, coming home from some lectures I had to do, and I was sat across from a business man with a brief case. I thought about his career and what he'd be doing and thought "nah, my job's more exciting than managing accounts and sending e-mails all day long". Probably a crass oversimplification. So, I'd like to start a thread where we can identify all the good things that can arise from doing a PhD, what it can lead to in terms of career and life. Why should we do a PhD, other than the obvious answer of getting an academic career.

Here is what I think:-

1) I'll never have to do a boring (though perhaps worthwhile and well paid) 9 till 5 job, that involves making other people very rich.

2) I'll have lots of (albeit niche) skills that may be of good value.

3) I get to work with people that are really interested in what they do, smart, challenging and that keep me on my toes.

4) I get to teach (yippee) a group of really interesting people that I learn as much as they (hopefully) do me.

5) The money won't be too bad in the end (will it?).

6) I'm learning new things all the time, my skills are getting better and better.

7) I'm autonomous, largely.

8) I work with lots of different technology and get better and better at delivering learning experiences to students through different media.

I know some of it may sound very basic and obvious, but to me, this is what I look forward to in the future, post-PhD. There may even be some other surprises too. So, though it has it's downsides, like any career, it more than makes up for it in other ways. I'll get to use my brain and get to continually develop.:-)

Hello, Sarah85. Often, having a paper rejected is not a question of it's quality or your talents, it's more a political thing. It's happened to me with submissions for conferences. From the description you give, it's definitely not your fault. Imagine, if he/she'd have said, sorry it's really badly written and conceptually flawed? The editor obviously thinks it's good enough for publication, of that there is no question, and has suggested submitting it elsewhere. I hope you do submit it to other journals and see what they say. At least you're at a stage where you can write material of an acknowledged publishable standard, you've got that skill, and that's more than half the battle. So, well done, I say.

Hmm, firm but fair advice there, Eska. BFH, would you not be able to liaise with your academic advisory team on your proposal. Even if some of did look at your proposal, think that it'll be quite specialised, so very few of us (including me) will be able to give the appraisal of it justice. I'm certain that there is a lot of help out there on the internet for writing and judging the quality of proposals for psychology-related research. Put the following search terms into Google and hit return: 'psychology phd research proposals'. You will note that the second one down is an actual psychology thesis research proposal (sorry if you have already tried this). There also a lot of other hits related to your query that I think will be very helpful.
Now then, Eska, do you really get paid £20 per marking of an assignment? That sounds really bloody good. I'm beginning to feel really under-appreciated by my research institute - I've just spent the entire day (plus procrastination allowance!) preparing a workshop for tomorrow and I get flippin' peanut - grrr. Ah well, academic jobs have just been rated the best jobs in the America (even though it doesn't feel that way to embattled little me) - http://www.timeshighereducation.co.uk/story.asp?sectioncode=26&storycode=409004&c=2

I know how you feel Bug, cos I deserve my stars too. I don't know who Sneaks mugged to get her extra star, but some poor forumite is lying around in a gutter somewhere, battered and bruised - and minus a star. I think this thread has become an allegory for the hyperinflation of grades in the higher education system. Back in my day, you really had to work for a 2.1 or 1, but now it seems like everyone is getting them, just like this star business. Next, the star system on this forum will probably be sponsored by Coca Cola and you'll be able to buy them.

Whoo! A 6 figure job, eh? Would that be in Ugandan dollars? Otherwise, I surmise that you must been keen, really bloody keen, on the idea of personal development. Let me educate/personally develop you...:-)
Quality assurance for online PhD programs is really crap - ask Paul McKenna or Gillian McKeith. Just type 'online PhD' into Google and you'll see all the hits that pertain to how dubious online PhDs are. Obviously, frequenting such a site as this will mean that you already have the necessary skills to do such research for yourself, more thoroughly. Now, as was said, I'm not saying there isn't potential. I'm just saying that, unless you check out exactly where you'll be doing this online PhD, it can be dodgy. Choose carefully, if you're thinking about it.
Now this 6 figure job, which I see you make such a big job of emphasising...it's gone past 3 in the morning - shouldn't you be spending some of that wad weighing down those pockets of yours? Ladiez of the night? Coke? Philanthropy? You seem to make a BIG point of it, so why not show off in person? 'Individuals like me who will have both experience and education will be the ones to advance the field' - you wouldn't be a banker would you? Educashun and real world experience? What a catch you are, if you weren't such a 'cock' - as in self-assured male chicken. You carry on strutting your stuff. Erm, I'm sure people really admire you. (up)

Hi Ev, I don't think there's a day goes by when I don't feel as though I'm not good enough, that I'm thick and why did I bother. Honestly, I don't myself feel up to the standard of ever getting a PhD. They're bloody tough. And it seems like you need to be so smart, like you need to know everything concerned with your subject. That in turn makes you think: how can I know everything? How can I even begin to start writing about things when I don't feel I understand what I'm writing about too well and/or am unsure that I can even write well anyway? Throw on top of that the life commitments that you have and it just seems impossible. Well, I have exactly the same perspective as you. I've just finished the first phase of my research, a descriptive phenomenological study and an expert has told me that it's, basically, (sorry, I'm going to swear) shit. Yep, absolute rubbish! How am I going to defend that in a viva?! I'm not launching in to a moan about myself, but what I'm trying to say is that doing a PhD is really challenging - it's right at the top of academia. There is nothing, academically, that will stretch you in the way that doing a PhD will, academically, in terms of your personal life and your character. It changes you, both in terms of your abilities and the realisation of them and as a character. I sometimes think back to how easy I had it as an undergrad now, and oh how I moaned. It was nothing, in retrospect.
I think Sue has put it far more succinctly than me. You are training to be a researcher and there is no wrong and right answer (not literally in terms of doing a specific procedure incorrectly)- it is more a question of how you do things, record them and solve the problems that you have. It's a learning exercise. But the fact is, tens of thousands of people get a PhD every year and some of them (including me when I get mine) are right dumbo's who couldn't find their way out of a paper bag. Like a roller coaster, there are ups and downs - times when you feel so low about your work that you want to give up. I've been there, am there - and you just want to jack it in. But to what? The thing about a PhD (I've found, but I'm strange) is that unlike an undergraduate degree, it's a part of you, it's an emotional thing. So the ups and downs you experience with your PhD reflects in terms of how you feel about yourself. I've been over the moon and stuck in the U-bend of a toilet (I'm there now) - but, like you, I'm never giving up! EV, no matter how it makes you feel, carry on regardless. Obviously, if you weren't suited to getting a PhD you wouldn't be where you are now - no-one would have offered you one for toffee. The hours are often unsociable, the work and thought that goes into it intense, the ups and downs extreme. But, the rewards are great in terms of a personal sense of achievement, the career that you will hopefully have before you great. When you get it, it's yours for the rest of your life, an achievement that very few people will ever achieve. Ev, your capable, your obviously a very bright and hard worker - you're, not to be patronising, just facing a difficult challenge at the moment.
Please remember that you can post your particular difficulties and experiences at any time, and I'm certain that if people can help they will. Your certainly not alone, people have experienced what you are going through at the moment and they (including me) are more than willing to give you the benefit of their experiences and (in my case limited) knowledge. Chin up, future Dr Ev (up);-)

Well, Bono, my new celebrity mate suggested I be more philanthropic like him and help the poor, disadvantaged people while being ostentatiously pious at the same time, so I gave you a star. Please don't thank me because it's my job.(up) Trying to write a systematic review is horrible - Saturday, Bloody Saturday.