As you say, society does (or should) know better and The Animals Act of 1986 insists that no animal experiments be conducted if there is an alternative. Unfortunately, it seems that the current situation is that the development of all new medicines requires at least some animal testing. So society must accept that if there is no animal testing there will be no new medicines. With the current threat of avian ‘flu, the need for new medicines and vaccines (for both animals and humans) is higher than ever. Society has some tough decisions to make.

Just to clarify, I have never (and would never) become involved in any kind of animal work and like you (and I'm sure, any compassionate person) I wish there was no such thing as animal experimentation.

inferior minds????!!!!! I cannot believe some of the things you come out with. I find it very disturbing that people like you are actually in science. There is nothing weak or inferior about considering the impact of your actions.

I dont like this thread, it should be closed. It's like everyone is paying homage to a false scientist.

Please close it.

I don't think he is a scientist. He has probably just doing an undergrad that is pointless, and he is bitter. So he pretends to be a PhD student, and tries to get attention.

the findaphd team remove my messages for less than what he says. Thats not on at all. Have some consistency!!!!

I think they are bitter because i think jobs.ac.uk is better. Which it is, the adverts look far better presented, and there is a better search engine.

Stu, comparing this site (FindAPhD & Postgrad forum) with jobs.ac.uk is comparing apples with oranges! Jobs.ac.uk is far more generalised and so obviously has many more posts.

I like the giraffe advert here too... ;o)

NB by 'posts' I mean job vacancies, not message posts!

I agree with Stu here about PostGradForum team being inconsistent. You removed Stu's thread (insulting yes) about johannstein which I can understand BUT that guy has not really offered much useful advice to people on here unless it goes along the basic lines of:

"The reason is because you are rubbish and I'm great therefore everything I say is the truth and nothing more".

I think the team should seriously consider removing him as a user, he doesn't really contribute anything useful to this forum.

We try to be consistent in removing threads, but we try to do so without stifling debate. If you simply insult somebody your message will be removed. There are some controversial views on this forum, some of which could be deemed offensive. We have removed a number of messages from Johannstein in the last couple of days. They do not appear in the 'removed threads' section because they were replies not individual threads. When somebody says something along the lines of 'my PhD's better than your PhD' it may be insulting, but who looks more stupid to other readers? Consequently we sometimes leave such messages on.

This forum is for grown up intelligent people, mostly to help each other through with advice and discussions on the ups and downs of postgraduate life. As Mia suggests, if you suspect somebody is using this forum to be deliberately controversial or to attract attention to themselves then ignore them. We will block people from the site if they continually break the rules, but we do believe in giving people a second chance.

The inconsistencies that you show are insulting!! You remove any responses we have to that johannstein, yet leave all his messages on (except a few as you said, but i don't believe you).

I think the best thing for us as students to do, is to not use this forum any longer and move our interests elsewhere.

Perhaps we should set-up a chat-room or a forum elsewhere.

I would prefer no messages or threads be removed rather than justa select few that show inconsistencies between the rules.

Any ideas, Mia, H, DanB? Would you be interested in doing this?

I feel like he is allowed to say what he wants and get away with it. When anyone else says something about him it gets deleted. I said something yesterday that got deleted.

If you are going to leave comments like his on here you have to xpect people to respond in the relevant (usually outraged) manner.

Don't worry Jen, that is how we all feel about this. I don't blame Johanstein really, as he is most likely having a laugh.

I feel that the real problem is with the findaphd team that run this forum.

There really isn't any point is banning Johannstein, as all he will do is create another username and he will be back. I think we should all allowed to debate on here, Johannstein included, but when our responses are deleted it becomes very frustrating.

If he says something stupid, then we should say so, I know that the comments I have made (that were ALL deleted) didn't contain any swear words nor did they contain any harsh words.

I think the best way forward is to not get rid of ANY replies unless they contain swear words or harsh words (such as personnal things about someones mum or something along those lines). Calling someone stupid, or insulting their brain power is not harsh at all.

Sort it out findaphd

Is Johannstein part of the findaphd team?

Yes, I agree with Stu. I can't believe the findaphd team would actually take the time to monitor what is posted here and try to keep the forum friendly! I mean, what are they thinking... some people! I really can't abide intelligent debate where people can put forward completely differing points of view without being personally insulted for it. People who post with opinions different to my own should just be deleted from the forum, and then we can have posts of unanimity!

Seriously, I think there is a difference between personally not agreeing with someone else's point of view in the context of a debate, such as the one on this post, and then being plain insulting. I may or may not agree with animal testing, but I respect the right of others to have a different belief to my own, and to defend that belief. I do not have the right to just plain insult people because they have a different viewpoint. I believe that is the difference between the posts that have been deleted and the posts that have remained.

Anyway, I look forward to joining you in your new forum, may I suggest www.haveatantrum.com