hi Elsie thanks for posting! Please do keep in touch if something comes for you, it will really motivate us all!

love satchi

hi everyone, I received another rejection letter today (Letter no 6!!)
I don't feel sad :-)

I think posting about my job search experience here has helped me a lot.
Thank you so much.

I've still got 3 pending-job apps, so the Waiting Game continues!

love satchi

Hi Satchi, I applied to more than 100 jobs. Many I don't get response and I think I got more than 30 rejection letters but now left counting. Once I apply I just forget and don't even expect a call or email. I am kind of sick of these things. I actually don't have any expectations now ! It is tiring and I am actually tired. Have not applied anything recently but thinking to apply today - though there is no hope that I will get any response.

hi Swetchha
can I ask you--did you also apply for jobs that were not advertised--like contacting a company etc?

I make a list of the applications I've sent in, together with the deadline
and then I just cross them out when I receive a reply.

Personally I think it is kinder if they would just reply back and say NO thanks we don't want you, instead of not replying at all. People say it's because there are hundreds of applicants--and companies have no time--but really I think it is a matter of courtesy because real people sent in job applications, not a bunch of virus.

I think getting job rejection letters is easier for me to handle now. Better to come before interview, than after.

thanks for your post
love satchi

Hey Satchi!

Not been on here for a while!

The job thing does seem to be really tough right now. After my PhD I got a postdoc at a UK university, but was really unhappy there, and quit a few months ago without having anything else to go to. It was a scary time but I couldn't carry on doing something that was causing me so much grief. I have got another postdoc now at a different university, which I started a month ago, and it's going well, but I had a total panic between posts. One thing I would recommend is sending your CV around to relevant people- I looked up a few teams that do research in my field and emailed the team leader with my CV attached, just in case there were any posts coming up that hadn't been advertised yet. Two people from different teams emailed back and told me that they had a post-doc coming up and that I should apply. As it happened, I got a job in the meantime and didn't end up applying for those, but it's a good way to get your name around and an excuse to make personal contact with people. Might be worth a shot? So much seems to rest on who you know...

Good luck with it, you'll get there! Best, KB

Hi Satchi,
With the list of jobs you've applied to you can work out what type of jobs and universities/departments are rejecting you and which ones showed interest. Also ask for feedback after interviews, though feedback quality can vary - some people take the time to explain why you didn't get the job and the successful candidate did, while others prefer to be tight-lipped and offer only short generic statements.

Keeping note of your job search experiences and interview feedback not only allows you to improve your applications and interview performance, it also helps you to better judge which jobs you are more likely to be shortlisted for (and which jobs you will just be wasting your time on). Colleagues may advise "apply for everything", but I really don't agree. Applying for jobs is incredibly time consuming and you have to be realistic, otherwise your job search will eat too much into your time spent on getting experience in research/teaching/other work. Many many jobs will come up for which you match or exceed the minimum criteria, but you probably have little chance of being shortlisted, making it hard to know if it is ever worth taking the time to apply! One way is to ask the person in charge of making the hiring decision if they would be interested in you. Most of the time these people say "yes" by virtue of you meeting the minimum criteria. In order to tell whether they are genuinely interested (and therefore likely to shortlist you) is if they actually take the time to show their interest, engage in some meaningful dialogue with you and actively encourage you to apply.

As for replies to applications, in my experience academic employers almost always let you know if you've been shortlisted or rejected, though they sometimes take a very long time. Non-academic employers are generally very awful communicating the outcome! Even when you call to check the progress of you application, they often never ever give you a definite yes/no answer. Weird!

Hi Satchi,

I have just applied in advertised post. Also, sent CV to few people I know or referred to but have not sent to someone I do not know. Do you think it is good to send CV to someone I do not know? Have you done so? Swetch

hi Swetccha
Thanks for posting! I've only sent my CV when I applied for jobs (and that is to people I don't exactly know), does that answer your question :-) People are saying we should make informal enquires (there is another thread on this somewhere). I found that when making informal enquiries, it doesn't really guarantee anything--but it makes me feel good to some extent.

I find it difficult to upload my CV for speculative job applications because when CVs can be changed--so what I write doesn't seem to be universal for everything. Has anyone uploaded their CVs like that? For example--you put it on a university job website in case openings come up.

love satchi

Hi Satchi, how diverse is your job pospect pool? Are you only applying to Universities? Universities are only a small source of research, are you applying to public bodies and private organisations too? E.g Government departments, public bodies, NHS, charitable trusts, private companies. There is so much research and policy development that goes on outside of University, start thinking outside of the box.

Teaching is always an option. The Open University often have teaching posts or what about looking at teaching in FE or even compulsory Ed. The salary range and opportunity for advancement in secondary teaching can far outstrip most Uni posts. Lots of teaching courses will give generous bursary depending on your quals, whilst 'teach first' will actually pay you a wage to do your cert. As you said you've done some teaching if you joined a recruitment agency I bet they could get you some FE teaching work. Lots of FE colleges have undergrads these days.

If applying for non-academic or 'foot in the door' jobs you could also 'omit' some of your quals from job applications and re-word your Phd to be more like a student research position, highlighting your employable skills over your academic achievements.

Good luck

hi wowzers
thanks for this! its great advice. Come to think of it, I have only applied to universities!!!
I haven't looked enough at job adverts at public bodies etc. What I have seen so far are ads for professional/IT/managerial work which I don't seem to be able to apply for.

I haven't joined a recruitment agency yet, that is something I'll have to look into.
thanks again :-)

love satchi

Hi everyone,
Just wanted to say, don't read *too* much into the response you get from informal job enquiries. Obviously, making an enquiry and showing your interest never means you will get the job!!

My point is: if an employer bothers to show some real interest in you before you apply, it suggests they will bother to at least consider your application when you submit it and not toss it immediately it in the bin.

On the other hand, if you see an advert for your dream job but after an informal enquiry or two the employer is clearly less than enthusiatic about the prospect of you working for them (e.g. he/she avoids talking to you directly, seems to act all awkward around you and looks like they can't wait to leave - happens to me, true story!), then it's still up to you to apply or not. When the rejection letter arrives, it shouldn't be too surprising.

For private sector and public bodies do a google search. E.g I'm in education but I'd still check places like exam boards such as City and Guilds and AQA, charities that work with children like Barnardos and the Childrens Trust, Gov departments like OFSTED and Dept for Education, professional bodies like the Institute for Learning etc. Whatever your area there will be a diverse range of employers, find their website, click their 'jobs' tab and see what opportunities they have in the area you think you might be interested in. If it's health research there are loads of different bodies and charities that contribute to research and policy debate.

Additionally, check sources you used in your PhD or sources quoted by others in your PhD in your references. Find who published the report/document then check their website for jobs or contact details for a speculative application as they are obviously research active.

hi wowzers WOW you are like a massive FOUNTAIN of resource :-)
thank you for your suggestions. I've actually had to write down what you've posted (besides printing out this thread for myself as a reminder!), it helps keep me organised.

Hi JanineG
are you still looking for phds, don't give up. Have you tried recruitment agencies for temp jobs? I'm sure someone will contact you soon for a job or phd interview **Fingers crossed**

does anyone have any idea how long employers give a successful employee to accept the job offer? For example--if you had your interview on 25th May, and they offered you the post on say 28th May. So how long would it take for the applicant to think about it?

thanks
love satchi

Hi Satchi

I am still applying for PhDs, problem is a lot of PhDs aren't in my field. I have registered with a few agencies for jobs and I haven't heard back.