paper help please
Quote From cj_again:
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Presumably you could still use the 'Inter Library Loan' system from the prison library? and / or send satchi your first visiting order :p
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Quote From jepsonclough:
Thanks Wally - I will sleep easy in my bed tonight ;-) I was so worried that I would be thrown in prison where I would have no access to journals so I could learn the error of my ways.
Thanks Wally - I will sleep easy in my bed tonight ;-) I was so worried that I would be thrown in prison where I would have no access to journals so I could learn the error of my ways.
Presumably you could still use the 'Inter Library Loan' system from the prison library? and / or send satchi your first visiting order :p
This really made me LOL - wish I could give you a star :-)
Quote From cj_again:
Will have to wait until I answer your next 'journal article request'
:p
Quote From jepsonclough:
This really made me LOL - wish I could give you a star :-)
This really made me LOL - wish I could give you a star :-)
Will have to wait until I answer your next 'journal article request'
:p
I nearly fell off my chair at that one!
Quote From cj_again:
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Hi Eskobastion
As the new moral adjudicator of the forum I just wanted to clarify your point regarding it being 'morally right sometimes'. How many times? I have from time to time assisted fellow forumites (and they me) with the odd paper and a spot of advice. I will of course be presenting myself at my local police station now that I realise that whilst I was only trying to be helpful (and get that first elusive star!) I have indeed committed a heinous crime (akin to that bloke 'knock of Nigel' they keep talking about in all those dvd trailers).
But back to my earlier point - as of yet - it does not seem to have been habit forming. Am I redeemed given that my infringements only occurred under the 'sometimes' category???
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Quote From Eskobastion:
Stealing may be morally right sometimes. But not
if it becomes a habit.
Stealing may be morally right sometimes. But not
if it becomes a habit.
Hi Eskobastion
As the new moral adjudicator of the forum I just wanted to clarify your point regarding it being 'morally right sometimes'. How many times? I have from time to time assisted fellow forumites (and they me) with the odd paper and a spot of advice. I will of course be presenting myself at my local police station now that I realise that whilst I was only trying to be helpful (and get that first elusive star!) I have indeed committed a heinous crime (akin to that bloke 'knock of Nigel' they keep talking about in all those dvd trailers).
But back to my earlier point - as of yet - it does not seem to have been habit forming. Am I redeemed given that my infringements only occurred under the 'sometimes' category???
I really can't give you a definite answer. Moral questions are not easy to answer.
Personally, I could give a copy of an article for somebody who needs it desperately if:
- he or she has tried to acquire the article from his/her uni/department/tutor/etc
- his or her uni refuses to buy the article
- he or she is not able to find the same information from a different source
- does not duplicate it and returns/deletes it immediately after the usage (I don't want
that articles spread over the net with my customer credentials printed on the margin).
But not on an online forum. And not if I do not know him/her personally.
But how often? Once or twice a year? Maybe. I don't know. I have not had to think about it..
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Quote From walminskipeasucker:
Authorized Users [someone at an institution that subscribes to the journal] may transmit to a third-party colleague in hard copy or electronically, a single article or item from Wiley InterScience for personal use or scholarly, educational, or scientific research or professional use but not for re-sale.
Authorized Users [someone at an institution that subscribes to the journal] may transmit to a third-party colleague in hard copy or electronically, a single article or item from Wiley InterScience for personal use or scholarly, educational, or scientific research or professional use but not for re-sale.
Thanks for correcting me. I appreciate it.
That is why I wrote in another reply that I would not personally deliver a copy of an article to somebody who I don't know personally.
And not on an online forum.
I could not be sure if the recipient uses the article really "for personal use or scholarly, educational, or scientific research or professional use but not for re-sale". And if the unknown recipient decides to duplicate the article (or ebook, or an issue of a journal) and sell or distribute it widely I can't do anything about it..
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Quote From jepsonclough:
Well I hope you remember that quickness is not an excuse next time you are up against a submission deadline and the British Library is your only legal hope - if you can afford to wait a week for an article then some (not me of course) might think you are underemployed.
Many of us are doing our PhDs part time while balancing full time jobs, health difficulties, caring responsbilities (children, parents with dementia etc) and we squeeze our research into the evenings, weekends and annual leave. In those cases if we don't get the article now it will be of no use to us.
You are obviously in a far more priviliged position than many of us and I think you should appreciate that and not criticise the rest of us.
Quote From Eskobastion:
As for the quickness, I consider it not to be a good excuse. Why should we get everything fast or now?
As for the quickness, I consider it not to be a good excuse. Why should we get everything fast or now?
Well I hope you remember that quickness is not an excuse next time you are up against a submission deadline and the British Library is your only legal hope - if you can afford to wait a week for an article then some (not me of course) might think you are underemployed.
Many of us are doing our PhDs part time while balancing full time jobs, health difficulties, caring responsbilities (children, parents with dementia etc) and we squeeze our research into the evenings, weekends and annual leave. In those cases if we don't get the article now it will be of no use to us.
You are obviously in a far more priviliged position than many of us and I think you should appreciate that and not criticise the rest of us.
I am a part-time distance learner. I started my degree when I was deployed abroad (peacekeeping mission). I wrote my first papers in my "academic career" in my accommodation container at nights. Now I am working full time (and I have to travel often). I have a daughter to whom I must (and I want to) devote my time after I come home from work. In addition, my partner studies part-time too, and we have to share our study time. So I am able to study at nights and in the weekends. I finished my last essay 0400 hrs in the morning in a hotel room so I was able to sleep two hours before I had to wake up. This situation is very stressful.
But I must confess you something. I am not a postgraduate student; I am a mature undergraduate student. However, my aim is not to get a degree but to get a first class degree. In addition, I want to (and it seems that I am able to) publish something before I graduate.
So I kind of "have been there, done that." But obviously my experiences are nothing if compared to the emotional and physical burdens of PhD students..
But I would not use anything I have written above to explain my deviant behaviour if I decided to do something which could be considered to be illegal.
Quote From Eskobastion:
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Thanks for correcting me. I appreciate it.
That is why I wrote in another reply that I would not personally deliver a copy of an article to somebody who I don't know personally.
And not on an online forum.
I could not be sure if the recipient uses the article really "for personal use or scholarly, educational, or scientific research or professional use but not for re-sale". And if the unknown recipient decides to duplicate the article (or ebook, or an issue of a journal) and sell or distribute it widely I can't do anything about it..
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Quote From walminskipeasucker:
Authorized Users [someone at an institution that subscribes to the journal] may transmit to a third-party colleague in hard copy or electronically, a single article or item from Wiley InterScience for personal use or scholarly, educational, or scientific research or professional use but not for re-sale.
Authorized Users [someone at an institution that subscribes to the journal] may transmit to a third-party colleague in hard copy or electronically, a single article or item from Wiley InterScience for personal use or scholarly, educational, or scientific research or professional use but not for re-sale.
Thanks for correcting me. I appreciate it.
That is why I wrote in another reply that I would not personally deliver a copy of an article to somebody who I don't know personally.
And not on an online forum.
I could not be sure if the recipient uses the article really "for personal use or scholarly, educational, or scientific research or professional use but not for re-sale". And if the unknown recipient decides to duplicate the article (or ebook, or an issue of a journal) and sell or distribute it widely I can't do anything about it..
In addition, there are a lot of other publishers whose terms and policies are not as user-friendly as Wiley's..
hi everyone! after posting earlier, I went to print out the paper (not saying which one :p haha) that I desperately needed to read; then I went to the lab, when I finished, I went to buy groceries; and now I'm back!
I would like to add also, having read the posts; that my supervisor did call me to his office one day; he had acquired a book through inter-library-loan which was not available in our library; he told me to quickly go and photocopy one chapter which he said would help me. After that I was to pass the book to another student. So obviously the license was not paid by the university.
....maybe I should tell my professor to pack flip flops and rations too.....
I have had great help from people here and I appreciate it so much.
love satchi
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Quote From satchi:
he told me to quickly go and photocopy one chapter which he said would help me
...
So obviously the license was not paid by the university.
he told me to quickly go and photocopy one chapter which he said would help me
...
So obviously the license was not paid by the university.
Yes it was. Your university has obtained a CLA licence which allows photocopying of books, articles and other material.
The Comprehensive HE licence licence allows individuals to copy up to one chapter or 5% of a book (http://www.cla.co.uk/data/pdfs/he/he_comp_aug10.pdf).
So your supervisor seems to be a well-informed and law-abiding citizen.. :p
I am happy that my orginal post got the attention it deserved in a form of long thread of replies.
Let's change the direction of the discussion a little bit and forget the economics of electronic publishing.
How long is the pathway from using illegal or infringed material to plagiarisation and fabricating research results?
Comments?
Quote From Eskobastion:
How long is the pathway from using illegal or infringed material to plagiarisation and fabricating research results?
How long is the pathway from using illegal or infringed material to plagiarisation and fabricating research results?
Erm, a looooooooong way. Borrowing a paper to read, and then properly citing the author within your own work is entirely different to plagarism. The fact you cite the person means that it can never be plagarism! And fabricating research results doesn't seem to have any relevance. Are you suggesting that because we want to learn and expand our minds on the various theories/research out there by sharing it among us, we'll suddenly say "oh actually, this scientific lark is a bit silly, why don't I just make up some results and publish them!?"
Quote From sneaks:
Borrowing a paper to read, and then properly citing the author within your own work is entirely different to plagarism.
Borrowing a paper to read, and then properly citing the author within your own work is entirely different to plagarism.
Nothing wrong with borrowing. However, I have been writing about using material illegally.
Quote From sneaks:
Are you suggesting that because we want to learn and expand our minds on the various theories/research out there by sharing it among us, we'll suddenly say "oh actually, this scientific lark is a bit silly, why don't I just make up some results and publish them!?"
Are you suggesting that because we want to learn and expand our minds on the various theories/research out there by sharing it among us, we'll suddenly say "oh actually, this scientific lark is a bit silly, why don't I just make up some results and publish them!?"
If a person justifies copryright infringement on the grounds presented in this thread (mainly difficulties to obtain research papers by using legal means), would it be possible that the same person could start plagiarising others or manipulating research data to make things easier for him/her?
In other words, is there really a strict line between certain types of deviant behaviour (in this case between copyright infringement and other academic misconduct)?
I am not suggesting anything. I just wanted to discuss would it possible that one type of behaviour leads to other type of behaviour..
