I know you probably feel you've explained it, but to be honest I just can't follow the logic. Universities have creches for their students children to attend!! It may be that if you are a younger woman then waiting three years is nothing, but if you are over thirty and the time is just personally right for you, waiting three years may be an awfully long time, especially if you want more children later. Fertility declines after 30 and 35. I just think maybe you're suggesting it's better to wait because you're not yourself in the position that others are, but it doesn't mean they are wrong and irresponsible and I still find the whole planned pregnancy bad, unplanned pregancy fine duality. It's very judgmental

Re: your second post. Yes, of course. But your career begins after your PhD.


As Cryogenics said, prioritise. And she ain't that smart if she thinks that morning sickness goes well with an intensive period of education.

Just seen the message about puking up whilst writing a thesis - where does that come from Juno!! Have you actually met anyone pregnant! you are implying they become jibbering puking idiots with no brains!! My friend is nine months pregnant and works as a headhunter in the city - please - I think the whole pregnant women are pathetic and ineffectual prejudice is just really ignorant!!!

I agree with Sassy.

we need responses from other people! would be interesting to see the male/female divide though.....

Sassy: sickness is unavoidable.

She should not proffer the information, but if she has definite plans to get pregnant during that time: don't apply for the PhD. Have the kids first and then do the PhD. Or do it part time.

You are right in that I'm not in that position: I'm in my 30's but I'm lucky enough not to want children.

You are right. It is unheard of for anyone to vomit whilst pregnant. My apologies.

Juno - I understand - just make sure you let any female friends you do have who are going to get pregnant benefit from your extensive wisdom on the subject - "puking is unavoidable". I have this hilarious image of a female pregnant PhD student like the woman in little Britain projectile vomming uncontrollably, spraying people with chunks as she drags herself to work. You are obviously far more capable than any of the brilliant women I know who are or have been pregnant and continue in full-time pressurised, stressful jobs without showering their colleagues with vomit. Thanks for correcting me

This is getting quite heated, I like it Ok, just kidding. On a more serious note, I have scanned through the opinions of sassy and ras31 and juno and I have to say I agree with juno. She has had to explain herself for the nth time (quoting you juno). If I were a woman, planning on doing a PhD, I would not put a child in that same thought process. What I mean is I would not be thinking having a child within that period.

Even as a man, I would not plan on having a child with my wife if she were in the course of her PhD. Like I said earlier on, it is much better to put thing in perspective and do things in their own time. A PhD is far too much hassle on it own without combining it with having a child (even if many women have gone through this, to which I raise my imaginary hat to- that is courage and determination and i truly admire it)

Personally, i would put off child bearing until a few months before I’m done or until when I’m done totally. Like juno has pointed out, 'accidents do happen' (but i believe everything happens for a reason). In that case, a woman should be able to receive all the support she can get to make life easier for her.

Sorry for the long post ladies, i just thought i should share that and for you to get a guys view, at least

Thanks Cryogenics Good to have your calming influence; I was getting a bit facetious there, so Sassy: I (genuinely) apologise for the puking comment; it has clearly upset you. As for the rest: well, I've said my piece and I think now I will agree to disagree with my detractors.

Thanks Cyrogenics - I think your points are really interesting and I think they provide a really balanced view of what to think about when making that decision. I don't personally agree with them but I respect your opinion because it is measured and non-judmental. My problem with Juno's post is that it reinforces an idea that women who are pregnant are rendered incapable and vomit ceaselessly which is actually almost funny. Morning sickness is not inevitable, it only lasts the first trimester and I just think implying that women become somehow lacking when they get pregnant adds to a pre-existent prejdice that women face. I think any woman considering having a family whilst doing a PhD will have considered the issues for herself.

I also don't understand Juno's idea that women have a family then a career, that this is the correct order and that they are separate issues. You don't just have kids then put them in a little box whilst you start a career - they are still there and you have to deal with building a career as a mother and society has a role to play in that. But don't worry Juno - if I get pregnant in the next few years I shall always remember your words with a smile! "Sickness is inevitable" and reach for a mask...

well i will out myself and say that i am very deliberatively planning on trying for a child whilst doing my PhD. that doesn't mean it will work for sure.

i would not dream of telling anyone like for example my supervisor in advance. it might never happen! i mean 1 in 5 who try to get pregnant, don't. so it would honestly simply be stupid to put other plans on hold whilst trying to get a family going.

i am unfunded. is it then, considering i don't live in a social vacuum, more ok to deliberatively try for a baby, than if i were funded? i know i asked this question before, but noone replied to it.