@Chickpea-that sounds like a good idea. Is it okay to send you a PM so you can sort my official and professional language to request this letter? At the end of the day, with the growing tightening immigration for non-UK applying for UK jobs, I really am concerned that I am loosing out on jobs that really suit my profile but I can't get those withiut strong reference letters. It is a cultural proglem. I might get a UK PhD, but, I might not be able to cut through the job market purely because I might seem to be unprofessional because of a different cultural background.
The employers might invite me for interview but the refernces might fail me! I apply for jobs every week and anytime, I might get lucky and really don't want reference letters to let me down. Your assistance would be highly appreciated.

Of course she can't get me a job but she can definitely further ruin whatever little chance I got by writing a poor reference letter. I want to be safe than sorry and ask her honestly if she likes my research and can write positively about positions I am interested in applying. It's political, as you know, with jobs so scarce, she has her favorites and wants them to do better before I get there. But at least the are some jobs the tony will fit my profile and it is for those jobs the fi need her support considering her reputation.

I am going to be seeing one of my supervisors for the final time before I submit my revised thesis. My experience with this supervisor has been wrought with emotions. She is wellkonwn and very professional and recently became HoD at a
UK top department in my area. So it does mean a lot to me that she will come down to see me and discuss her views on my current draft. However, I also don't trust her as had she refused to supervise me anymore last year when I had submitted for the first time. I was rushed into submission and being an oversees student, I have to work twice harder to work on my language and also meet the deadlines. It's a lot of pressure. As a result, I have little trust in her at the Moment but at the same time, still need her to write me job refernces. But the problem is I am not sure if she likes me enough to get me a job. I think PhD is already a big ask for her in her mindset and that probably, accodring to her, i should give up after PhD. But I am not sure how accurate I feel about her at all. As a result, I really want to take this opportunity coming in our next meeting, to ask her if she will write me a supportive reference letter since she knows me for so long ! How do I ask without offending her and jeopardizing my chances of getting my thesis, one final time, read by her. What are good academic practices to follow in order to get an honest response from her.

Dear adam

First of all hats off to you for pulling off well with academic delays. What I don't get it how can you be failed if they offered you conditional PHD, aka minor corrections? That is totally unheard of. Anyway, I have just posted a query about my own viva situation, do comment upon it. In my case, the examiners didn't give me hard time and I agreed with their corrections as I was rushed into submission by my supervisors who said they won't supervise me anymore. And now that I just submitted revised draft for them to see if I have followed all the corrections by the examiners, they are again wearing a authoritative hat and co minute to challenge my abilities. ,my supervisors who seem to be in denial and refusing to accept that I am not anymore writing for them and their boisterous attitude is driving me up the walls. They are not answering my questions and gave no comments on the revisions as if it was meant for them when it's meant for the examiners. Does it matter if I take all the time given to me to revise and resubmit? Does that get counted against you? I am Very furious with my supervisors.

It will sound bizarre but my PHD thesis has already been examined and I have receive R& R outcome. I did not appeal and decided to work on the corrections. However, my supervisors are still giving me a hard time, I am getting Impatient and think that maybe this institution might not be best for for me after all. How can I transfer to another institute at this stage? How to convince another department or institute why I need to transfer and argue for no further fees as at this stage, I have no means to pay fees at all. I dont Mind considering Europe as well of that is where the best fit is. I will drop out of this uni and just walk with whatever they give me. I am tired of arguing with the supervisors and fear that they might make it much worst if I said ito them that at this stage I am only rewriting for my examiners and not for them. If the supervisors had understood what my research was originally, surely I would not have landed with R & R outcome. That said, I have almost entirely worked in the revisions as suggested by the examiners and feel that the supervisors are just continuously looking down upon me when they are the ones who bought this outcome upon me. I feel outraged and even before I resubmit, I want to prove to myself that I can do without them and walk out of this situatin whenever I want to. Thanks for reading.

Hi Andie

Wow...you are one hell of a brave person. A lot has happened with you and you have managed it so far. Have trust on yourself and your work. R & R is all about being gutsy and they are trying your patience to see how much you can sustain and still carry on. There is no doubt you are passionate but circumstances have gone out of your hand and you find yourself in an ambitious project. I would concentrate more on your interpretation and analysis and wait for the formal viva report to arrive before you get too panicky. It is in that report that the examiners get a chance to put down everything they want you to do in the final submission. I was a bit lucky, am in social science and in my viva, they cleared me but not my thesis. And they said there will not be another viva as they could see I was able to verbalise but they wanted the same confidence in my writing, so, I got generous amount of time. I am quite happy, it's like a free treat to get this opportunity to sit down and write and clarify. But to be fair, I submitted my thesis less than two years of returning from the field. Amongst my cohort, I was the first one to have my viva and all of my other colleagues got 5 months additional and no wonder they all got minor after their viva. Also, I am on a visa so there are university set restrictions that they have to follow set by UK immigration guideline about maximum time limit. Now, I am more than half way through, enjoying it a lot, and more pleased with the additional time I got! Obviously, when you see your other cohort graduate before you, it reminds you of your viva outcome but, you get over it quickly because you trust your work. So, shut all that noises of doubt and fear and I am sure there must be someone other than your supervisor who can be there for you without judging you. That what you need. Like you, my main supervisor is incompetent. He can of handle and understand and be confident about my research, that is why he creates many doubt in my mind about my research. As a result, I don't confide in him anymore. I go to another more well-known professor (I know two of them who support me) and I am getting my draft read by them. Don't shut them. Once your work will shine through, all these other noises will also disappear and your supervisor will be more than happy to be associated with your success.

Happy New Year to you Mara Sp!

Many congrats! It would be great if you had been present to attend your graduation. But, you have already surpassed those ceremonial obligations. Now, you have to help others and help them through the process. Thank you again for all your support.

Hi PhdDefault
I think I should have asked for an explanation as to why they thought they could not supervise me anymore. I did not know I could have done that-another problem of being an international student and being vulnerable and easily taken advantage of as I don't know my rights-as if I have any. Thankfully, I didn't get any extra fieldwork to do as part of R & R, only additional material to bring in and to clarify what my project is really about. You have to understand that I am not in a position to question or challenge my supervisors. As told earlier, I need them at every step of Phd-both academic and admin-and I am quite easily bullied and intimidated by them especially by one of them. I tried to do everything they asked me to so when they told me to submit-I trusted them. However, in hindsight- I think the reason I got n R & R is to punish me for not anonymising the informants. Or else, basically, the correction is of six months-three of which is already over now! I do trust my supervisor's scholarliness and the professionalism infact, I think they are equally upset as I am by the outcome. However, I don't think it matters to them as it does to me if I fail even after R & R. How does it matter? Who cares? They have taken my money and i have also lost the opportunity to appeal. That deadline expired a month ago. I did not take the appeal route as I know that often will result negatively on me in addition to bureaucratic delays and no other university will accept me for a Phd and also, I will loose academic references to get both jobs and another Phd program somewhere else as I will be obviously questioning my supervisors .

What option do I have but to accept this outcome and hope for the best and continue to trust my supervisors will support me. I am not at all enjoying this -everyday I cannot help but think I should have appealed, and other kinds of doubts slip into my mind. Makes me question so much that I feel mentally crippled and don't know if I can ever trust academia. I am genuinely intimidated and will take time to recover And feel normal. My only consolation is that I have been given until 2016 to resubmit. So, I am taking this time to recuperate and build my confidence and pretend that my supervisors will write me reference letters no matter what and at least help me get a job if not a Phd. I am devastated. This is completely undermining my initial enthusiasm of genuinely doing a Phd. Not to mention the huge financial damage adding to my guilt.

If I have understood you correctly, you submitted your final thesis after five years or the research proposal after five years? It will be crazy for you to submit a research proposal that takes 5 years to develop. What year you joined the Phd and what degree were you pursuing when you first arrived to the UK?

Keyboardplodder- yes...I agree, I need more confidence, a different way of looking of what has actually happened. My supervisors keep underplaying this aspect of anonymity even today and keep tell me that it is something I should do a week before the final submission of R & R. But, I am having a nightmare about this and nothing is going to console me....

Treeoflife-

no...the supervisors can give extension and the international student can then apply for more time from the university and subsequently the home office will then have to give visa extension to International students based on what the university has been told by the supervisors. My uni' immigration office told me that at this stage, I can get indefinite extension with the support of my supervisors. In my case, my supervisors said they CANNOT SUPERVISE ME ANYMORE. that was the end of the matter, I cannot argue. If I were a local student, surely I would have got support indefinitely and not be forced into submitting a trash thesis. If they wanted to, they could have supported me and given at least three more months-that's all I needed.

international students land up paying four times the money local students pay for Phd. In that sense, to be facing incompetent supervisors is unacceptable.

I am the rare international student who has got R & R outcome in my school. Most of the R & R are local British/EU students who submit after 4-5 years of joining the program (this is in social sciences where supposedly British students are expected to have an advantage over non-english speaking students like myself). I am ashamed as I have let down international students in my department who are superior not only in English writing than local students, but are also great leaders and high achievers in their own country. Unfortunately, I am none of those....I feel awful.

Remember you don't have to make a huge claim otherwise you will get into trouble in the viva. Keep your ambitious projects post-Phd. For Phd, play safe. Even if you feel the contribution is minuscule, it still matters to research. It depends how you will shape it in your writing and engage with the wider literature more that is what committee will look for-your awareness of the wider literature more than the scale of your contribution. Your story has to start from others work and then end it towards how you have taken it and re shaped it.

I would wait until your data is ready. That way you will know how others looking at questions you are looking at have approached and concluded and what new you are adding. Start with the data, then narrow your theory and engage and critique and show what is lacking in them that you have managed to answer. You already have the theory with you now go with it and see if it fits your field and if it does not, then that is your contribution.

Jstanley-same approach as mine or else it looks like a bribe! Better to wait until the outcome of the viva.