A nice cheery thread, what fun :-) Lol at the STDs, although the PhD could be likened to a nasty itch that just won't go away :p

Hmmm, I've not done much today, I did analyse some data that needed doing, but also had to travel to campus to meet with my supervisor - it went well, although my thesis is changing direction methodologically - again... sigh.... but tomorrow is another day - I got a task done, had a big meeting, have a new plan, so yes, I should be happy. One day and one small step at a time and then we'll all be geniuses (or at least we can pretend to be!!!)

They don't look too bad, a few 2:2s in there, but no fails and no thirds and you've got firsts and strong 2:1s too. Lol at the 19 year old you, yes, unfortunately most teenagers aren't to know the effect it can have. I can't see why, if you get a good strong masters that you wouldn't be accepted to do the PhD - funding is another animal altogether though - I have a first class BA, (nothing below a 67 - I'm a mature student and so wouldn't know a late night out drinking if it got up and bit me with 3 kids to look after) and a distinction at MA and still didn't get it! In my case it wasn't the strength of my grades but that my area fell between funding bodies, so neither would fund me lol - I did get awarded a uni scholarship though and also my fees are paid, but it would have been nice to have full funding.

I completely understand what you're saying too - its very hard. I do think though that yes, they were all stupid, but then stupid isn't the word to use really. You aren't stupid, anything but, look at you, you're doing an MSc, you simply cannot be stupid! You just don't have the depth and breadth of knowledge yet that comes from years and years and years of study. That's the only difference between you and them, time, pure and simple. The people that you're talking to all have more of that under their belt, more reading, more writing, more of these seminars ;-) I have always found it very intimidating, they just know so much (or appear to) and make me feel like an utter fool who would do better going back to reception class and starting again lol! But the thing is, that in time you too will be one of them lol, and the great tutors and lecturers are the ones that remember that - that are fantastic and knowledgeable, but remember how it feels to be at the beginning and help you through by being constructive. I don't think how you're feeling now says anything about your ability, only about the time you've had so far and the level you're working at - we're rookies Ogriv lol, we'll get there, but its a long journey and we're just at the beginning of it :-)

My supervisor is another who cringes at his PhD thesis, and tbh, having read it I can see why lmao!!!! I mean, its very good, better than I could do now (but he had many years to do it) but compared to what he does now its so simplistic, so basic, written in a totally different style, and through that I can see how he's developed and why he's now a prof but that once upon a time he too was a rookie student!

I am also a mature student (40) with 3 young children and I really do understand what you're saying and how you're feeling. I only work p/t and am a f/t student, but I'm busy all the time and I feel dreadfully guilty that i don't spend more time with my family. I started my BA when my youngest daughter was 11 months old and haven't stopped since - 3 years of BA a year of MA and now 1.5 years into PhD. She was asked once where mummy lived (as in where does the dog live, where does the bird live, where does the duck live blah blah) and she said 'at the library'...... ah. I did have a conversation with my elder daughter the other day, I was on a total downer and saying about this kind of stuff (she's 15) and said that I felt that by doing this I'd let them down in some way. She looked at me as if I was totally nuts and said for heaven's sake mum, you'd have let us down if you'd not done this. She pointed out in a very mature way that through me doing this I'm achieving (hopefully) my potential, and that if she'd had to live with the thought that I'd stayed doing what I was doing just for them then that would have been an awful thing. I can kind of see where she's coming from. Yes I don't see as much of them as I could do (although again, it was pointed out that when I'm studying a lot of the time I'm working from home so here physically) but that it also has shown them how to get here if you see what I mean. Hard work, a lot of it, and you get the grades, you move on and up. Its very very difficult when you're a mum, a nightmare at times, you're constantly stuck between a rock and a hard place and no matter what you do often feels wrong :-(

With regard to your proposal, that will come together and will change constantly anyway. I have to have a meeting with my supervisor tomorrow and with the way my field work is going I can see the whole darned methodology having to change :-(

I'm in history too - social/cultural - gender based, a bit of sociology chucked in for fun :-/ so wish I'd chosen something else right now - some nice early modern history would have been good - as it is, hmmmmm.......

Hi there, I think all unis do this a different way so its difficult to answer - I had my upgrade just before Christmas and all I had to do was my basic board meeting - prepare a paper, discuss it with the board and my sup then said this is the upgrade, the others all said absolutely, and that was that, no different to any of my other supervisory board meetings. In that respect I'm sorry not to be able to assist you in this, all I can say is that my sup told me that most of the time its a formality, they know by now if you're suitable to upgrade or not and would have spoken to you prior to this point if there was likely to be an issue and therefore, unless you pull a massive clanger you're safe. I hope that is the same for you xx

This all sounds so normal to me :-) I was worrying that I was alone in closely resembling an old, eccentric bag lady who needs urgent surgical attention - I do like the idea of handing out plastic surgery vouchers - I could also do with a tummy tuck by the end of this... lipo.... facelift...... etc etc etc - stuff it - a whole new me! I may steal a teenager's body and use that instead - ahhh for the world of sci fi! I worry that not only am I becoming very withdrawn and rather nutty, but that I don't feel well, like ever.... so tired, so stressed out, so depressed. Why in the name of holy cat sh*t do we do this to ourselves??? I used to be a normal person, you know, one that washed their clothes, washed themselves, went out, didn't sit at a desk all day muttering about abstract concepts - I had a life God dammit!!!! I'm frantically trying to work out why I thought this would be a good idea, I'm also trying to work out why my sup who I've known since I started the BA as a fresh faced, normal person, hates me so much that he encouraged me into this living hell... ahh well, I'm sure in years to come I will look back on this and smile - ok, so I'll be sitting in a corner rocking and drooling at the time, but at least I won't have deadlines ;-)

Oooh, that's a fantastic subject :-) I studied the history of medicine during my MA, and various other aspects of medical history during my time at uni (including some bits in my PhD) and its a brilliant area to study! I'm sorry that your career didn't work out - it had always been my plan to go and study medicine and it never happened for me, having said that, I think that now I'm on the right track and I too wouldn't have been that happy doing it. I really hope that you enjoy it, and I'm sure that during your training you must have touched on the past - a history essay isn't 'that' different, it just needs a slightly altered approach to the more scientific disciplines. I actually quite envy you lol, my History of Medicine tutor wanted me to continue to PhD focussing on that subject area, but I'd already set my heart on what I'm doing - part of me wishes I'd listened to her now ;-) I guess that's why I've changed direction slightly and am stuck in hospital records right now 8-)

Oh dear.... having read this and being mid 2nd year and I am not torn between despair and elation - I know sweet fa :-) nothing, its a disaster, I have not a clue what the heck I'm doing, but that's a good thing right? 8-) oh dear.... I was hoping it would all become crystal clear and I'd be a genius at some mythical point in the 3rd year when it would all become clear and I'd fully understand my topic and be an 'expert'. I honestly feel right now that my chances of graduating are zilch and dropping rapidly to the point of being laughed at or being stuck in an institution for delusional people. It'll come right, it has to, and reading that those of you so close to completion are also still slightly confused is good, it means that when you pass (and you all will) then I can feel better and hope that maybe its ok to just know a bit and not know it all iyswim.... Its funny, I remember when I was starting out on the BA thinking that by the time I graduated I'd know lots, I'd know all I needed to know... ha ha ha.... ahhh sweet innocence - maybe this is the same - we think that by the time we are Drs that we'll be complete experts with a full understanding and maybe it takes years and years of work past then to come close to that - actually, thinking about some of the academics I know that's probably quite correct, if they ever do gain any understanding ;-)

Hi there, I am a historian. I'm sure that your supervisor would be more than happy to guide you in your writing. What you're suggesting isn't cheating as far as I'm aware - I don't think that there is any obstruction to getting your work proof read, but I do think that possibly it is more about grammar and spelling than about content and argument - it may be that different universities are different though in that. What background are you from? You say you haven't studied history before, is your undergraduate degree in an arts and humanities subject or is all this completely new to you? I think one of the most important things about writing history is a complete acknowledgement that the past is a foreign place and approaching your sources and discussion not from a 21st century basis, but with an engagement with the time period to be studied and the norms and values of that time. A lot of a history MA is teaching you how to do that, how to approach historical sources and really getting you thinking about how your bias and culture and customs can intefere with your ability to engage fully with the subjects you are studying.

I'm sure plenty of people here would help you, but one of the main aspects of doing a taught degree is guidance from your tutors, although I do appreciate that if your background is in a very different discipline then history will be a challenge for you, having said that, if they didn't think you were up to that challenge they wouldn't have offered you the place :-)

======= Date Modified 23 Feb 2010 14:14:51 =======
Don't worry :-) as KB says this is normal and some academics are just utter idiots and completely out of touch with reality! Some are amazing, others.... well.... least said I think ;-)

We've all got holes in our work or our proposals that need sorting, and in a way its good that you hear this now and when you're feeling better can address it - it will only make you stronger. Its just a shame that some of the so called 'experts' seem to be on an ego trip half the time and consider their opinion to be equal to God's, and that as a lowly PhD student you're feelings are worthless. Remember also that the conference world and publishing world can both be pretty brutal, they'll have been treated like that, they forget that our confidence is not what theirs is and it hurts.

Chin up, soldier on, you sound like you've got a great supervisor and HOD and they will help you through this. You're doing great, this is only the first year, and things will solidify, you'll get more confident (I keep telling myself that lol) and in time you'll look back on this and see it as a blip but one that made you that bit tougher and gave you an opportunity to grow :-)

God luck Moomin, crazy I know but try to enjoy it :-) You'll be fine, I seriously doubt anyone approaching their viva has been laid back and chilled about it. Enjoy this opportunity to have a captive audience who'll sit and listen to you talk in depth, it may never happen again lol!

You're definately not too old, and I don't think that your industry experience will damage your chances in the slightest! I am 40 now and in my 2nd year, I'm about an average age at our uni for PhDs. We have some in their 20s, but certainly in my dept most are in their 30s and above, one of the men I did an MA course with has just started his PhD and he's well into his 70s!

Oh dear, if this wasn't so serious this would be hugely funny - what is it with sups? I still am having difficulty stopping giggling over the nipple comment - heaven help us all!

My main sup is brilliant, the one I had before though was incredibly strict - I met him for a discussion and he had a brown paper bag, he said that he needed it to get through reading my work due to all the commas, I was causing him to hyperventilate - oh ha ha - then the other sup said I had't put enough in - cue big argument between them. The same sup also gave me back my dissertation, 8 days before submission and said it was really good, just a few points to address - on every single page were at least 15 red marks!!! I asked if that was good what he did if it was bad and she waved a carrier bag with shredded paper in it and said - I give you it back like this :-) ahhh, he's a charmer, top guy to be fair, but omg.... My friend's supervisor at BA couldn't be contacted and would run down corridors to escape students. In the end she camped outside his office as the deadline was approaching and she'd had NO feedback or comments or discussion in a year. He arrived, took one look at her and asked, why do you keep stalking me, what do you want from me???? - she pointed out that he was her supervisor, she needed him to supervise and comment on the dissertation that she had to submit which accounted for 25% of her final year marks - and he said that if she wasn't able to spot where she'd made a mistake then she wasn't fit to hold a BA, turned and ran off back down the corridor - pure class!