Hi PoorStudent,


Your post resonates with me strongly. I'm currently on "temporary withdrawal" from a fully-funded ESRC (DTC) scholarship I obtained at a prestigious institution. In the meantime, I have got myself a position working within HE whilst I chew over my options concerning the PhD. The duration of temporary withdrawal is around 1 year for myself; with this in mind, is this an option for you?


With regards to funding, from the date I went on temporary withdrawal my income from the scholarship ceased (I was paid on the 1st of every month). I haven't had to pay anything back, and if I did decide to "permanently withdraw" then I would owe nothing to the University or the ESRC. CAUTION: Whilst this is the case for myself, I HIGHLY recommend you evaluate the terms and conditions of your scholarship in order to determine whether or not you will be punished, for want of better words. In addition, if you're unsure I would also recommend contacting the administrative people responsible for the scholarships to seek advice.


Good luck my friend.


MoC

So, what is this dilemma? Well, prior to receiving the aforementioned job offer, I was invited to an interview for a role in the NHS which deals with research and project management. This job is (1) more varied, (2) more challenging, (3) and pays a higher salary (£21,000 vs. £17,200, before tax). Like the receptionist role, it is also a permanent position. The interview is August 18th, but I must give a decision for the receptionist job on Monday the 11th. What do I do?!?! My problem is twofold:

(1) Do I take the receptionist job? It pays me £932 per annum more than my PhD, once tax has been deducted. Thus, is it worth taking this job or staying on the PhD and seeking more opportunities out? By my reckoning, I need to make a decision regarding the PhD by January. In December, the NHS Graduate Scheme opens, and in October the National Offender Management Graduate Scheme (NOMS) opens. I'm interested in both of these, and I'm sure more opportunities would arise in the interim too, so I'm unsure what to do!

(2) Do I go to the interview? My head is telling me YES! Its a Band 5 role with more responsibility and it offers a greater challenge. Even if I accept the job for the university it would only be a verbal agreement, not in writing. But, is this ethical? Could I really turn round and say I don't want the job anymore if I were offered the NHS role? Decisions decisions ... To complexify this further, I know research in the NHS is something I've always wanted to do, so this is an outstanding opportunity to do that ... argh! Maybe, I'm overthinking. Maybe I should just look at it like this: (a) accept or reject the job; (b) whatever I do, attend the interview. I don't know!

Thank you everyone for your time and inputs (hopefully!). Its good to get second, third, fourth, fifth etc., opinions on this!


MoC

Hi all,

Some of you will remember me from previous posts; for others, this post will be the first of mine you've encountered. In that case, some context:


I've been a fully-funded PhD student on a 4 year (3+1) pathway for around 10 months. The extra year is to satisfy the funding body, as I already have an MA in Sociology. My problem is simple: (a) I'm not enjoying my PhD; and (b) I don't want to enter academia, upon its completion, pretty much rendering my PhD in Sociology useless.


So, I've been applying for jobs for some time now. And, success! I was offered a role with a university yesterday. However, I have some reservations and a dilemma I could use some advice for. We'll start with the reservations. Prior to undertaking my PhD, I occupied a role on a reception desk at a NHS Trust specialising in mental healthcare. I enjoyed my role as it was rather varied and no single day was the same, however, I always felt like it was a stopgap job on the path to something greater and more challenging. The job I've been offered is, once again, a receptionist role. One of my career options is to pursue a career in academic administration as I consider it a career I would (a) enjoy and (b) be rather good at. However, can anyone here shed some light on career development prospects within academic administration? Is it slow-moving? Is it possible to move forward from a receptionist role? I really really do not want to be stuck in that position for the next 3-4 years!

***CONTINUED BELOW***

Hi Nick1,


Thank you for your replies. Can I ask, what is your PhD in, and how many publications, conference talks and papers do you have at this point? One of the biggest issues I've seen with the academic world is that PhDs are considered to be the bare minimum that an individual should have. And because PhDs are not classified once completed (i.e., 1st/2:1/2:2/3rd), its not the individual with the best written piece of work that gets ahead; its the individual who has produced the most publications (i.e., "publish or perish") and made the most connections at conferences. To be honest, I dislike the culture too. Its full of people constantly initiating bullshit conversations and, when they do talk about something relevant, its either (a) all about them and their research, or (b) spoken in riddles for them to constantly re-emphasize their own academic prowess. I must state, these are MY OPINIONS. They are NOT objective, universal facts!

I'm sorry to hear of your situation, and I hope it improves in the near future. May I ask, how do you manage to stay motivated? Did you enjoy your PhD when you were in the process of completing it? One of the problems we consistently suffer from in this society is "anti-intellectualism." Employers do not want people who are academically intelligent; many degrees are pushed aside as "mickey mouse" courses (I blame the media for this); and, I personally believe there is a high degree of envy swirling around company's and organisations, particularly from the managers we are most likely more qualified than!

Personally, I'm not a person who has no experience. I worked 6 years in hospitality as a bar supervisor, and 12 months as a lead receptionist in mental healthcare. So, I do have the experience! But employers can't look past my Master's degree. It feels so degrading that I now have to delete it from my CV and job applications


Thanks again!


MoC

Hi tophdornottophd,


What you say in your reply bears resemblance to the "sunken costs" theory, whereby your basically cutting your losses early on. From my understanding, the experiences that you explain are not uncommon for PhD students. After all, the withdrawal rate hovers around 50% for the lions share' of universities. Some of the primary reasons for this do include a lack of funding and individuals who don't finish their PhDs in the allotted timeframes, thus running over by substantial periods of time and becoming less and less engaged in their work.

I agree with you regarding the PhD and its versatility in the employment market. I guess its different for more vocational PhDs, such as biochemistry or psychology, where you can leave the program with a freshly minted doctoral degree and actually pursue becoming a "biochemist" or a "psychologist." The big issue with sociology is that no one employs "sociologists;" those who define themselves as a "sociologist" have usually gone down the academic route of becoming a senior lecturer. And to be honest, the majority of social research organisation's and company's that find PhDs desirable for certain roles usually only offer fixed-term contracts for which you must combine your PhD with 2-5 years experience in the field.

Can I ask, what did you do in your PhD? Was it a social science?


Thanks for your comments!


MoC

Hi Fled,


Thank you for your astute comments! You certainly pull no punches. I totally understand and respect where you are coming from. If I'm 100% honest with myself and the people who have read and/or contributed to this post (after all, it is an online social environment!), all I am is a good essay writer. I write well. In fact, I write really well. But that, along with my forward-thinking ideas and concepts, is about as far as I go concerning my ability to be a model academic. So, yes, I don't think I would make a very good/convincing PhD scholar, nor academic for that matter. Plus, its something I can honestly say I don't want to do.

Thank you for the heads up on some opportunities for a social science graduate like myself.


MoC

Hi folks, sorry for the lateness of my reply ...

HazyJane ... At one point, I was going to book an appointment with the careers service regarding my applications and the possible pathways I could take with my degree(s). The issue here is, I'm already fully aware of my options. I have a BA in Sociology and a MA in Social Research. With these qualifications, most career pathways require further study (i.e., probation officers, counsellors, social workers), a PhD (higher education lecturers), or simply leave me in a position where I just have the "wrong" degree for going into a particular career (i.e., no teaching posts want sociology!). So, I'm a bit screwed. At this stage, my options are fourfold:


(1) Gain another master's (at the cost of another £4,000) in a more vocational area that appeals to me (i.e., such as counselling or social work).

(2) Go back to university and do another undergraduate degree in something more vocational that appeals (i.e., nursing) and where jobs are readily available.

(3) Throw myself into the fire of the graduate job environment (I have gone for some graduate schemes); and

(4) Get myself a job in something and build a career the "old fashioned way," if you will.


The catch in all of this is the fact that, ideally, I have to have something in place before I can leave my PhD. Look, £1,134 per month is not a great wage by any account, but it is what it is: an income. I regularly ask myself, would I leave a job that paid me this much with no alternative to go to? Probably not.


Thanks for your comments,


MoC

Hello everyone,


Some of you might remember me from two previous postings covering: (a) my desire to leave my PhD program; and (b) the anxiety I had regarding notifying my supervisor of this. Here I am again.

Its now June, eight months into my (3+1) PhD program. At my university, it is expected that funded students undergo their upgrade within 12-18 months of their start date. My supervisor has discussed taking the upgrade in May next year, thus allowing more time for my project to become more specific and coherent. Whilst this provides generous breathing room, I feel like I'm leading a double life: on one hand, I'm chipping away at the project I'm engaged in with a view to undergoing the upgrade next spring; on the other I'm applying for jobs.

This neatly segues to my next issue: applications. So far, I've racked up around 140 since January, generating a pathetic 4 interviews. I consistently find myself ticking all the boxes on person specifications (i.e., qualifications, knowledge, skills) until I get to the big E: experience. May I add, I have an MA in a social science and I've worked constantly since 2004. I just lack the relevant experience that these, primarily administrative, roles require. Despite spending a year working reception in mental healthcare.

So, basically, I'm in a position where jobs are hard to come by and the upgrade looms. I've even considered (not that I want to) the possibility of ending up on the dole as a result of all of this. The reception job was not great, £16k - £19.5k (I had night shifts too), but it provided a good base from which to seek additional opportunities, such as a research job interview I had earlier this year in healthcare (£26k - £30k). I just feel so lost at the moment; stuck in a hole with no way out. This is why I state that the PhD is the worst career decision I have EVER made (up till this point, of course).

Yours faithfully,


MoC

Hi all,

Again, I am overwhelmed with the helpful replies that you guys have provided, so thank you!!!

Ian:

Firstly, I undertook both my BA and MA on a full-time basis whilst working full-time as a bar supervisor. It was tough, and I sacrificed a lot to get it done, including friendships and a long-term relationship at the time. My life was the antithesis of "normal." A normal week for me would look like this:

Mon: 0900 - 1800 (uni) Night: OFF
Tue: 0900 - 1530 (uni) 1700 - 2330 (work)
Wed: 0900 - 1900 (uni) After 1900: OFF
Thu: 0900 - 1600 (uni) 1800 - 0000 (work)
Fri: 0900 - 1600 (uni) 1800 - 0100 (work)
Sat: OFF
Sun: 1100 - 1800 (work)

And in my most recent position within the NHS I have worked a pattern of shifts that deny one's freedom of having a normal life.

Thank you for yours and HazyJane's really kind comments regarding my suitability for doing a PhD! They're much appreciated. To be honest, maybe my analytical thoughts and approach to life is rooted in the cynicism I have for modern life more generally haha! And I am kinda published already, albeit via Open Access.

I think its a little discourteous if I claimed to have received little support from my supervisor. Honestly, they only became ill in February. Up till that point, they had been tremendously supportive. I'd say that I first started feeling like the PhD wasn't the pathway for me about six weeks (mid-November) into the program. Hence why I have taken such a long time in order to make a reasoned decision - it changes my life whether I stick or twist.

Addressing all responses, it does seem that honesty is the way forward. This has come as a relief as I hate distorting the truth! My hands are tied for now, in any case, because I cannot "jump ship" - as it were - prior to obtaining a job of some kind.

Many thanks.

MoC

Hi Fled,

Firstly, thank you for taking the time to reply with some very insightful comments.

It may be due to my cynical nature, but I always operate under the impression that the society in which we live DOES NOT value honesty. You see many people (personal and professional) who tell the truth and end up on the wrong side as a result. That being said, I agree with your comments about "cookie cutter" resignations and the fact that most people, especially within academia, will just see through it.

I'm a notoriously honest person. I believe in doing the right thing both for myself and by others. I also believe in the power of the truth. The two concerns I have, however, are: (a) what effect it will have on the funding (i.e., will they demand ALL money back [totalling about £8,000 and this years fee]; and secondly, (b) my supervisors current health and the effect (both personal and professional) having one of their "PhD students" withdrawing will have.

It is pertinent that I note that the university department that deals with the PhD funding arm does would not require me to pay back anything; the only money to be paid back would be over-payments (i.e., if I ended in May and I was paid by the funding body until July I would have to pay back June and July). However, returning to point A, is this policy flexible? And would it change if my reasons were merely "career change"?

Thank you again!

MoC

Hi all,

This is my second post on this board. The first garnered some really good responses which enabled me to take different factors into account whilst making my decision(s).

So, after much deliberation, I have decided that withdrawing from my course is the most beneficial move for myself with regards to my career progression. However, I have an issue with notifying my supervisor.

We haven't really had that much contact in the past two months. My supervisor is currently undergoing treatment for an illness, however they are still contactable. So, to be honest, I feel REALLY bad about all of this. They obviously saw something in me to take me on (I interacted with them prior to being accepted by the university after reaching out), they're currently suffering from an illness, and having a student "quit" or "withdraw" apparently reflects badly on their portfolio.

I was just seeking guidance in how I actually approach this. As I have outlined, this is a rather volatile situation. I feel like I'm causing enough damage to my supervisor through withdrawing alone, without putting my message across in a way that is offensive.

A second point concerns whether I tell the TRUTH or the "truth." The reality is, the PhD is not for me, neither as a long-term or short-term goal. With this in mind, do I cite this as my "official" reason for leaving or do I fabricate a reason, therefore making it an easier process to cut away from. Bear in mind, I'm a fully-funded student, who's just approached their sixth month.

Many thanks!

MoC

Just want to add another comment in my reply frenzy!

Thank you once again to you all. I am humbled at the thoughtfulness, depth, effort, and passion that has gone into each response.

I'm quite an honest, truthful and respectful individual. Therefore, I have responded to each of your comments individually and as candidly as humanly possible for me. I hope that everyone can appreciate this.

Thank you again! (I know I should stop with the thank you's!)

@SimonG

Thank you for your comments.

Yes, I understand that 5 months seems a little premature, as HazyJane highlighted. However, I did do Law in my undergraduate and had similar feelings. I internally transferred from Law into the social sciences in the January of 2007 (only 3.5 months in) and have never once regretted it because it was the right move for me.

And yes, fully-funded for four years! Addressing both you and @HazyJane, maybe I should complete this year first, at least until May when all the first-year modules are completed and assignments handed in, as the successful completion of that will result in the award of a Postgraduate Diploma (I believe) which is less than a master's but helpful nonetheless and has a significant research methods component. In regards to MRes's and MPhil's, as this is the first year of a 4 year programme (3+1) I wouldn't qualify for either until the end of next academic year which would be around June/July 2015.

Returning to @SimonG's comments about the PhD retaining non-academic value upon its completion, yes I agree it "might." But herein lies the key issue. What if it doesn't? Is the risk of doing the PhD for it to be worth nothing and to be over-qualified worth the journey? This, yet again, is another question I have been asking myself over the past two months in particular.

Thank you again

@HazyJane

Thank you for your comments.

You make the essential observation about me not fully experiencing the PhD as of yet. I agree with this, particularly considering that I have only being doing a kind of "foundational" level in which I'm undertaking modules, in order to please the funding body I imagine.

However, I have had two years out prior to the PhD and to be honest I figured that this could of been a possible reason for my lack of motivation. That being said, I think the truth is that I'm a writer, not a reader. I read what I need to read in order to get the job done, its a very pragmatic approach. I won't, for example, go and read something because I find it interesting. It has to have some value to me. Hence, I have been motivated with the assignments I have done this academic year and have garnered really positive results, I just do not feel like I can see myself reading for the best part of 20 months (if I do 12 months research & analysis 2015 - 2016; and 12 months writing, 2016 - 2017) with minimal results (as in completed pieces). I feel that my primary motivator throughout university wasn't to gain knowledge but to get the best grades I possibly could, thus enhancing my potential employability --> Crude, cold and inappropriate material to do a PhD, right?

Another point I must make, to avoid confusion here, is that my degree is not in healthcare. It is in social sciences. I was in healthcare in an administrative capacity only, not a clinical one. In regards to my friend, yes she is very fortunate, especially considering that she has got a job in clinical research with only a social sciences degree. That being said, I did have an interview for a clinical research officer position back in January, which I should of never really got truth be told. As for her obtaining further qualifications, the NHS supports this as you undertake your work and actually provides paid study leave

Thank you again

@DonnaG

Thank you for your comments.

Your reply really stood out to me. It seemed to state the nuances that make up this decision in really logical terms. I agree with you that motivation is a key concern. It is something that has been at the nucleus of my thoughts as of late. I make my way to university with the attitude of it being another day for me to get through and that kind of attitude makes me think "why am I doing this?, Surely I should be going to university full of enthusiasm and desire, right?" We had a talk from a professor the other day and he summed it up perfectly, he said: 'When I look at the list of potential candidates I can supervise, the single most important quality I seek is curiosity, the "fire to know."' This really struck a chord with me, primarily because it is the "fire to know" that is the key to being motivated.

I think the major difference I have experienced is the lifestyle element of a PhD. For example, when I did my undergraduate and my master's they were always an additional activity. I always had a job. The PhD seems to demand you to make it a "lifestyle." This is best expressed in the chats I have had with fellow colleagues who seem to devote entire days (from the time they wake to the time they sleep) to pursuing their research, and what I assume to be their lifelong ambition(s). I don't think I can embrace that lifestyle in the same way, hence my predicament.

Thank you again