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Enough data for a PhD?

M

Hey guys,

I'm due to submit my thesis in lab-based science ASAP.
I'm sure this is a common feeling amongst PhD students, but I am concerned that I don't have enough data.
Funny enough the data I do have is interesting, and I'm confident that it adds to my field, but I'm concerned about the quantity and that I might be deemed as having not done enough.
I've been lucky and have managed to do a fairly low number of experiments (in comparison to my peers) but gained nice data. I have a few other experiments that I planned not to include in my thesis, mainly as they didn't work or are negative data that doesn't add much. Therefore, its main purpose would be proof of myself having done other work.
From the point of the examiners, what's the best thing to do, keep my three small chapters of interesting results with good controls etc, or add some of my non interesting/ possibly bad experimental design results in order to bulk things out ??
Common sense tells me to just write up the good stuff, but I could do with reassurance from people in a similar boat.

Thanks for any replies in advance!

P

How many papers do you have?

M

None, unfortunately my supervisor doesn't prioritise publishing and just sits on data for years.
Not a single person in my lab has gone into a viva having had a published paper.

T

Quote From MissyL:
Hey guys,

I'm due to submit my thesis in lab-based science ASAP.
I'm sure this is a common feeling amongst PhD students, but I am concerned that I don't have enough data.
Funny enough the data I do have is interesting, and I'm confident that it adds to my field, but I'm concerned about the quantity and that I might be deemed as having not done enough.
I've been lucky and have managed to do a fairly low number of experiments (in comparison to my peers) but gained nice data. I have a few other experiments that I planned not to include in my thesis, mainly as they didn't work or are negative data that doesn't add much. Therefore, its main purpose would be proof of myself having done other work.
From the point of the examiners, what's the best thing to do, keep my three small chapters of interesting results with good controls etc, or add some of my non interesting/ possibly bad experimental design results in order to bulk things out ??
Common sense tells me to just write up the good stuff, but I could do with reassurance from people in a similar boat.

Thanks for any replies in advance!


So... you have generated hypotheses, tested them, and decided not to disseminate them!

This is why we have a problem with publication bias and research waste!!

M

[/quote]

So... you have generated hypotheses, tested them, and decided not to disseminate them!

This is why we have a problem with publication bias and research waste!![/quote]

Are you not aware that you can fail/run into trouble in your viva if you have poorly designed experiments lacking controls etc ? There's a reason why some people don't include crappy first year work as you're still learning how to generate quality data that you trust to present to the scientific community......

P

I dont understand why you are not writing your own papers but it seems that this is a depressingly common theme these days.
It is possible to pass a viva without papers but it might be more difficult to prove you have done sonething worthwhile. It leaves you a bit more vulnerable on that score.

M

Some of us really struggle with the PhD process and aren't capable of writing papers solely on our own. Get off your high horse.

N

Quote From MissyL:
Some of us really struggle with the PhD process and aren't capable of writing papers solely on our own. Get off your high horse.


PM133 and I don't always agree but this behaviour is uncalled for. S/he is offering valuable advice, as the thesis is about 'publishable quality papers' and having that extra bit of real publishing makes it a bit more water-tight. Reputable journals should be double-blind peer-reviewed, so don't worry about getting embarrassed if you get a rejection, and critique from the reviewers and editors will defiantly strengthen the thesis and viva. It's not a high horse position, it is realistic and constructive advice.

For your question:
From the point of the examiners, what's the best thing to do, keep my three small chapters of interesting results with good controls etc, or add some of my non interesting/ possibly bad experimental design results in order to bulk things out ??

I think the former is better (a nice set of results with good controls), but what does your supervisor advise?

M

I am well aware that the core aim of a PhD is to generate publication quality work.
However, it doesn't work out that way for everyone.
If I had published papers/was capable of publishing papers ASAP, I would not have asked for advice.

I think submitting with 3 good chapters is a risk. You need to be really good with not many flaws plus have a decent external who likes quality over quantity. You could get an external marker who thinks that a thesis need x amount of work whatever the quality, and there will not be much you can do. Externals are hard to predict and better to play safe.

I would pad the thesis with some null results or method development. Just so that you can show off your skills as a scientist as showing the methods of being a good researcher is nearly as important as getting good results. As a thesis is supposed to show that you are capable of being an independent researcher and three chapters might not be convincing enough, even if you were published.

PS: A girl at my university got major corrections despite 3 first name papers and I think 4 other papers. She got major corrections because her thesis was quote "not a thesis", whatever that means.

P

Quote From MissyL:
Some of us really struggle with the PhD process and aren't capable of writing papers solely on our own. Get off your high horse.


Quote From MissyL:
I am well aware that the core aim of a PhD is to generate publication quality work.
However, it doesn't work out that way for everyone.
If I had published papers/was capable of publishing papers ASAP, I would not have asked for advice.


It is unwise to starting shrieking at someone who is trying to advise you. I was actually criticising your supervisor was for not getting you to write your own papers and then supervise you through that. Sadly, rather than ask me for clarification on my comment, you decided to shout me down like a 14 year old child. It seems to be something young people do these days. That is Strike One.

Sadly, you only get one strike from me.
Perhaps others will help you now. I am out of this discussion. Too old to put up with childish petulance.

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