Do other people find that friends that aren't working in academia/doing PhDs, and therefore don't know the structure and volume of work required, make comments like "well if you've got so much work to do you should work evenings then as well as weekdays and weekends..."?

I recently had a conversation with a friend who asked me how the PhD was going, and then when I merely said "oh you know, loads of work to do and not enough time, the usual", she turned around and said I should be "making more of an effort, putting in longer hours and getting on with it...no offence." To which I was thinking hang on a sec, I work 8-6 during the week, most Saturdays and most Sunday mornings - we all need a break at some point though! Just find it strange how people with no experience of the process we go through find it okay to make comments like that and think that we're somehow slacking off. Anyway, felt like getting that off my chest! Do other people come across this too or just me? :-)

======= Date Modified 02 Nov 2012 23:39:29 =======

This is why I prefer "PhD Candidate" or "Doctoral Researcher" rather than "PhD STUDENT". 

There is still a perception that students put in few hours, spend every nigth in the pub, lie in, only attend lectures or Uni. when they want to and (even with fees) are handed a free ride with the student loans.  Perhaps I exaggerate a little, however, to non-academic people there is at times no perception about what a PhD actually is.  They probably see it as just another course at Uni.

On the flip side, there's people in the real world who put in some serious hours and perhaps your friend knows what you're doing, but might be one of these long hours people.  "Stop moaning about your workload as I have to work long hours, so just knuckle down and get on with it", etc.

During write-up, I was putting in 12 to 16 hour days (including weekends at 8 to 10 hours) and this lasted for two years.  I couldn't have done any more hours if I tried.  My friends didn't know just how much I was doing and one suggested I would be better concentrating on driving lessons, even saying it was more important I learnt to drive for my future prospects than get the PhD.  As I was just weeks from submitting, I was not going to suspend at that stage just to keep my friends happy.  My mum ended up telling him to back off until I finished as she knew exactly the work I was putting in.

Just don't let it get to you.  You know how much effort you're putting in and if you're going in at weekends, how much more can be expected?

Ian (Mackem_Beefy)

hm I understand how you feel. But people out of academia can´t really imagine what you are going through. What happens when your fellow PhD students say ´oh you could work more?´ and they know you are working like hell? I literally felt like someone slapped me on the face when I heard this. I was like I don´t believe my ears. I never thought I would hear this from people who know I almost got sick from working too much. Anyway, I think only we know how much we put in it and we shouldn´t let anyone take us down!

Over the last few days I've been working like a dog! And there's only so much brainwork you can do, contrary to common perception using your brain is quite tiring.

Thank you for the replies guys! It's somewhat comforting to know that other people come across this too.

Ian - I completely agree, the word 'student' is completely misread in the case of people doing PhDs. Interestingly, this friend of mine doesn't work and has actually turned down jobs because they were 'too long hours', which I think is half the reason I was so gobsmacked and felt the need to vent!

Joanna - I'm so shocked to hear that even work colleagues sometimes say these things. I think you're definitely right though, it isn't worth letting people get you down.

DocInsanity - I hope you get some downtime after long periods of working really hard. I usually find that I need a couple of days of doing absolutely nothing after a really busy week or two in the lab just to recharge my batteries.

======= Date Modified 21 Nov 2012 12:54:20 =======
whoops! double post - sorry!

The number of hours we put in is sooo personal and dependent on so many factors! Have you seen Spiderpig's recent thread:(VERY) Close to submitting - amount of work? It may be enlightening, or comforting, or make you green with envy! In any case, the differences you see on this forum - from 24/7 toil for five years to 9-5 for three - are at least the experiences of people who are actually doing the job, so to speak.

I think I would be reflecting on why my friend said that-meaning 'what was her issue?', rather than taking it seriously. I think that most people recognise that PhD's are a great deal of work, although to be serious, most people also don't understand what they entail.

Everynow and then, someone who is a bit jealous makes a snide comment-I wouldn't take it any more seriously than this. But, likewise, if the friend is a good friend in other respects, then maybe be a little gentle in your expectations, and ignore it. If she keeps making them, call her on it.

Best regards PJ

Just ignored them! I have heard so much unpleasant and upsetting comments over the years. Some said it's just writing 80, 000 words if you just write 100 words everyday you could do it in 3 years time, some said you must enjoy being a "professional student" very much otherwise why you would want to spend so much time on your thesis. I know none of them meant to hurt my feelings but for people who are not in this, they just can't understand how hard it can be.

So, try not to let those negative comments affect you, stay positive is crucial to get you through this. I found spending time with people who understand what you are going through help great deal. Sometime, we just need a bit of understanding and encouragement to keep us going, which you can always find from this forum. :-)