Life after a PhD on PostgraduateForum.com

Hanginthere
7 years ago

Hi all,

Hope you are having a productive or restful Saturday. I am a third year PhD student and will be transferring to writing up in September, with the hope of submitting before July 2018.

For those of you that have been there, please can you tell me the ideal time to start looking for a job?
My PhD is in social science and I know that the labour market is very competitive, so I am doing my best to gain experiences.

I have two publication (one in a high impact journal), by the end of 2017.2018 academic sessions, I would have had 2 years teaching experience (leading seminars). Will these experiences be enough to make me part of the competition?

I know I need to focus on finishing my thesis, but I have just been preoccupied about what to expect after my PhD lately.

Thank you for your help.

T

TreeofLife
7 years ago

I started looking once I'd done about 1/2 my thesis writing as by then I was confident I would finish it by the deadline. This was about 3.5 years in for me.

What sort of job are you looking for? What you've described is enough for a postdoc.

H

Hanginthere
7 years ago

Quote From TreeofLife:
I started looking once I'd done about 1/2 my thesis writing as by then I was confident I would finish it by the deadline. This was about 3.5 years in for me.

What sort of job are you looking for? What you've described is enough for a postdoc.

Thank you so much for your feedback.
I am open to the idea of a postdoc. However, getting a lecturer position (which is more permanent) will be amazing.
I know the competition is stiff for both positions, just trying to make sure that I am ready.

With respect to when I can start searching, the 3.5 timeline is realistic. Thank you.

C

craigwhizz
7 years ago

Getting a lecturing position is getitng tough but can be easier at the less research intensive unis although I know they teach a lot more. For me, I know I am not productive enough to stay in a top UK uni - however, working in SE Asia, there is a lot of demand for scholars to teach in branch campuses etc. In Thailand, for example, the pressure to publish is much less and the lifestyle much better. However, not everyone can travel and be mobile (As a working class guy, I know this more than most). Research grants are much easier to get over here (Thailand) I can tell you! I could get virtually no money to support my PhD in the UK!

H

Hanginthere
7 years ago

Quote From craigwhizz:
Getting a lecturing position is getting tough but can be easier at the less research intensive unis although I know they teach a lot more. For me, I know I am not productive enough to stay in a top UK uni - however, working in SE Asia, there is a lot of demand for scholars to teach in branch campuses etc. In Thailand, for example, the pressure to publish is much less and the lifestyle much better. However, not everyone can travel and be mobile (As a working class guy, I know this more than most). Research grants are much easier to get over here (Thailand) I can tell you! I could get virtually no money to support my PhD in the UK!

Thank you so much for this craigwhizz, I am open to working abroad (preferably an English speaking country) for easy integration. I also agree with how difficult it is to get funding in the UK, with Brexit it is probably going to be tougher.

Thank you again.

T

TreeofLife
7 years ago

Lecturer positions are basically impossible to get without a postdoc.

A lecturer position generally requires anything from 3 years postdoc to 3-10 years of a fellowship. In order for you to get a lectureship after a postdoc, you can expect to have several Science/Nature papers + have just been awarded a 3-5 year fellowship grant, going on the people that have just got lectureships at my uni. That is the bare minimum. At the other end of the scale there are people at my uni that are fantastic researchers with fellowships and 10-15 years research experience but just can't seem to find a lectureship. Basically, you can't count on ever getting one and if you do then you are pretty lucky.

The alternative route into academic positions is a teaching role, like I'm doing, but these are generally temporary and may be non-progressable, although the pay and benefits is the same as an entry level lecturer.

H

Hanginthere
7 years ago

Quote From TreeofLife:
Lecturer positions are basically impossible to get without a postdoc.

A lecturer position generally requires anything from 3 years postdoc to 3-10 years of a fellowship. In order for you to get a lectureship after a postdoc, you can expect to have several Science/Nature papers + have just been awarded a 3-5 year fellowship grant, going on the people that have just got lectureships at my uni. That is the bare minimum. At the other end of the scale there are people at my uni that are fantastic researchers with fellowships and 10-15 years research experience but just can't seem to find a lectureship. Basically, you can't count on ever getting one and if you do then you are pretty lucky.

The alternative route into academic positions is a teaching role, like I'm doing, but these are generally temporary and may be non-progressable, although the pay and benefits is the same as an entry level lecturer.

Thank you so much for your detailed response.
Your analysis makes the whole business of working in the higher education sector worst than I thought. Nevertheless, one will continue to try.

Thanks again.

P

pm133
7 years ago

Quote From TreeofLife:
Lecturer positions are basically impossible to get without a postdoc.

A lecturer position generally requires anything from 3 years postdoc to 3-10 years of a fellowship. In order for you to get a lectureship after a postdoc, you can expect to have several Science/Nature papers + have just been awarded a 3-5 year fellowship grant, going on the people that have just got lectureships at my uni. That is the bare minimum. At the other end of the scale there are people at my uni that are fantastic researchers with fellowships and 10-15 years research experience but just can't seem to find a lectureship. Basically, you can't count on ever getting one and if you do then you are pretty lucky.

The alternative route into academic positions is a teaching role, like I'm doing, but these are generally temporary and may be non-progressable, although the pay and benefits is the same as an entry level lecturer.

Perhaps in some universities you will need several Nature/Science papers but that is not necessarily true in general. I certainly would not agree that it is the "bare minimum" across all or even most academic institutions.
The most important thing is probably to show you can bring funding in although even that is not always necessary.
It seems that who you know is more important than what you know.

It does appear to be very difficult though and I know of a huge number of people who hit their late 30s or enter their 40s without having secured a permanent academic position. I know of several who managed at around 40 years old which is an absolutely brutal situation to be in.

T

TreeofLife
7 years ago

Agreed pm133, I'm talking more about Russell Group unis, since that's where I'm based and most of my interactions are with others from Russell Group unis.