Hi all,

I am finishing my first postdoc with the same prof that I did my PhD. The idea of post-doc was to allow me to beef up my publication record which is gone smoothly and I am publishing my results. This may sound great but during the last 2 years ( thesis write-up + postdoc) I have not done any new research and I am already getting frustrated with my situation.

Another source of frustration is that the prof is on sabbatical and she has left the lab to an associate part-timer whom works in a 9-5 industry job and only shows up for few random hours per week. We do not have a similar background (her PhD in a different field but has 3 years more seniority to me!). Every time she shows up, she tries to micromanage me and asks me to do the basic things for her (i.e. finding journal articles, reading them for her and suggest a summary,or doing basic calculation etc).

Now, the prof wants me to stay for 1-2 years longer if the funding becomes available but when I look at the situation:

1) she is on sabbatical leave for at least another 1.5 year and cannot provide guidance or real help when it is needed
2) no project has been defined
3) the lab is in a bad shape as she does not buy new parts, equipment or supplies
4) I still will work under the annoying associate partner which I do not find knowledgeable
5) the prof always pays the minimum possible salary
6) I started my PhD almost 10 years later than average students and I have no time left to waste and need to be honest with myself if staying longer in academia is a good thing for me and my family

I feel that I am wasting a lot of valuable time for doing nothing but I do not want to get no or bad references from them. What should I do? Your thoughts are greatly appreciated.

Frankly, your question is a little weird. I guess you are in your mid-30s at least based on your statements, have a PhD and 2 years postdoc experience? And yet, it seems you are waiting for "your prof" to take career decisions for you. One of the main lessons you should have learned during your PhD and postdoc is working independently, and in particular setting and pursuing your own goals, even if they may be at odds with the goals of your colleagues (this includes your prof).

What are your career goals? Do you want to stay in academia? How many faculty positions have you applied to during the last few years, and to how many interviews have you been invited to? Honestly, if you have trouble finding a permanent position after a two-year postdoc, it is probably time to seriously consider abandoning any academic career plans. In any case, at least some experience abroad and/or as a visiting researcher at some prestigious institution are ESSENTIAL for any academic success. Both of these conditions are not achieved by staying with your PhD- and postdoc-advisor.

It seems you are waiting for you prof to come up with the funding, but how much funding have you acquired yourself? How about pursuing fellowships or initiating a research project or industry partnership of your own? If you ever apply for an academic position anywhere, a record of the funding you have acquired YOURSELF will be among the most important selection criteria.

Concerning "bad references", this is a matter of diplomacy and political skill, which are the two most important skills in academia in any case. Obviously, you should not simply tell your prof that you've had enough and are leaving. Tell her you thank her for her support, but that you think working somewhere else is necessary for your career at the moment. Offer her to keep collaborating and stay in touch even after you've left.

Honestly, based on your post, you will need A LOT more independent initiative to get ANYWHERE.

Sounds frustrating! Being micromanaged and relying on part-timers are two common frustrations of employment these days. On the bright side, you are in employment and are being offered more work, subject to funding. It might be an idea to see how much you can define the upcoming project and be proactive in gaining funds for your department. On the other hand, I can see it makes sense to look out for other job opportunities at the same time as doing as much good work as you can in your present post, given the limitations that you mention.

Take the extension if only to make sure you remain in work. However, look for something else outside academia as even if you take the extension, they can't stop you from leaving.

I know the situation is uncomfortable (and I know what being micro-managed feels like), but remaining in work in some form is also important and it's easier to find work whilst still in work.

As regards 'bad references', bear in mind if they do this they are exposing themselves to a slander action if the comments are unfounded. Handle diplomatically if you do find something though to ensure there is no bad blood.

Ian (Mackem_Beefy)

Thanks all for sharing your thoughts.
@Walter, though I agree with taking the lead on my career and that I might need more than few initiatives to get anywhere, but I wish the real life was as sample as the way you described it. I had to minimize my writing in the post to meet the maximum words so I reduced the original post to show the main objectives of my message and this might have caused the confusion and weirdness of my message. The fact the matter is staying in academia is getting harder and harder every year and even getting a postdoc in the current situation is extremely difficult. Note that in area I live, the universities budgets are cut between 10 to 12 percent. My current department has not hired a new prof for the last 3 years (also 5 has been retired or left and their offices are empty!) and the number of postdoc has been halved since I started and getting a post doc offer is considered a privilege. I am in my late 30s and have a partner and 2 kids and it is not easy just to say no to our main source of income in hope that I might get more personal satisfaction by being a visiting researcher at some prestigious institution. Note that my current PI is also a world-class expert in our research field (though I think she has past her prime and becomes cheap in spending money for new research). I did quit an industry job and came for PhD because I felt I need to know more and learn more and quitting just to go back into industry makes me feel like a flip-flop. I know I might get nothing at the end of PhD+ postdoc's but I feel that going back to industry also make me feel that the time spent was wasted. I know there are people out there asking themselves the same question because the real world is a bit different than we had imagined when started our PhDs.

@ metabanalysis and Ian thanks for the feedback. As you described, the situation is frustrating and uncomfortable but then again being employed and associated with the uni gives me the opportunity to look for new research positions or even (eventually) come up with a fund (considering that there is no shortage of good ideas for new research).

Struggling with short-term contracts for few years in hope of academic jobs at the end or leave for industry and possibly work with some degree of unhappiness; I have been giving it a lot of thoughts the whole last year and still have not decided which path to take. But the pressure from my spouse has been increasing to finally decide which way to go. On one hand, the current post doc might get extended for a year or two (whilst I am looking for a new path). On the other hand people saying that in order to get to the other side of the sea, you need to leave the shore you are standing on. I am sure you know, it is not easy to convince yourself!

Although Walter put it harshly, I would urge you to consider what he is saying as I think there is some possibly unwelcome truth in it. Rather than blaming others for the lab being unchallenging, what are YOU doing in your current post to make yourself more attractive as a candidate for the sort of jobs you want in industry and academia? And how competitive are you if you looked at your cv critically? If you are not nationally / internationally mobile because of your family situation, then networking in your region is going to be vital for instance. I don't blame your spouse for putting pressure on you to decide something - endless discussion and uncertainty is horrible for your family as well, and it might be that their interests have to come ahead of your dream job. Could you not agree what for both of you is non-negotiable e.g. location, working hours, job security and then you have a set of parameters to work within and perhaps can see more clearly what you need to do, whether that involves more publications, getting a grant independently etc?