I'm thinking about doing a PhD and ditching my full time job. I'm honestly just not enjoying my job (working in consulting) in comparison to my time at uni.

I've done 5 years at uni, one of which was an MSc year so have written two dissertations. I've got a few questions about what it's like to be a PhD student and I'm hoping that some of you guys could maybe take 5 minutes to answer them and talk to me to help me decide what to do with my life... most of the questions require relatively short answers!

- What is your annual stipend for your PhD, and did you have to find it yourself or did the uni find it for you?
- How much per month do you make on top of the stipend at the university and how do you earn it (e.g. marking coursework, teaching duties etc.)?
- During an average day how much time do you spend working on your project?
- How often per month do you see your supervisor?
- How involved are you in the 'life' of the university (e.g. participation in student clubs/societies, sports, union etc)?
- Do you feel that you'll be able to easily step into a career in academia at the end of your project? If the answer is no, where else are you considering working?
- Do you enjoy your PhD, if not why not?
- If you have worked in consulting previously, and then decided to do a PhD, how did you find the transition from work back to study?
- Do you expect to finish your project in the time allocated?

Many thanks in advance for your help, if you want to ask me anything then feel free!

What subject are you doing? There is a *huge* difference between what to expect from a humanities PhD and a science PhD.

I'm a scientist (as you can probably guess from the name :p) and I'm happy to have a go at answering your questions.

- What is your annual stipend for your PhD, and did you have to find it yourself or did the uni find it for you?
I get ~£15,000-£16,000 a year from the university, but they take £3,000 off that to cover fees, so overall I get paid ~£3,000 every four months. The project I applied for came with funding which is fairly common for science PhDs but much less so for the humanities.

- How much per month do you make on top of the stipend at the university and how do you earn it (e.g. marking coursework, teaching duties etc.)?
I do demonstrating in labs for 1-2 halfterms a year. This will generally pay ~£300-400 a half term for five 7-8 hour days of labwork and the marking that goes with it.

- During an average day how much time do you spend working on your project?
My standard hours are just 9-5. If I have a deadline or an interesting experiment that carries on longer than expected I'll stay later. I don't think I've ever left the lab after 10pm though.

- How often per month do you see your supervisor?
Lots. He's really interested in what his group are doing so he'll often pop into the lab just to say hello and ask about that day's experiments. We also have a group meeting every week, and occasionally we'll have individual meetings if there's a specific piece of work to discuss.

- How involved are you in the 'life' of the university (e.g. participation in student clubs/societies, sports, union etc)?
I'm not really. I've got one society that I'm a member of and turn up to occasionally, but I stayed at the same university as my undergrad so I have a lot of non-student friends who are still here.

- Do you feel that you'll be able to easily step into a career in academia at the end of your project? If the answer is no, where else are you considering working?
No idea. I'm going to try to get a postdoc, but I'd probably be happy with any job where I got to do research in the areas that I'm interested in. I just want a job where I can mess about in a lab and not be glued to a desk all day.

- Do you enjoy your PhD, if not why not?
Yes. I didn't when I started, and I think that's because I rushed into it so had a lot of doubts, and I felt very isolated and confused as my group started out as only me and my supervisor, so even simple things like where to dispose of waste were a complete mystery and caused lots of stress. These days I'm having fun with it.

- If you have worked in consulting previously, and then decided to do a PhD, how did you find the transition from work back to study?
I went straight from undergrad to PhD so can't be any help here.

- Do you expect to finish your project in the time allocated?
Not within the three years, no. My supervisor and I spoke about it halfway through my second year and agreed that I would keep doing lab work until the end, so I expect to spend a few months after that completing writing up.

I hope that's some use, even if it might not be that relevant. :)

Yes, it'd be a science PhD.

Thanks for your reply - it helped a lot! I was worried that I might start liking it and not like it towards the end, or run over by years or something like that.

Sounds like you're having a great time - best of luck with the remainder of your studies, sounds like you're doing really well so far :)

Thanks again for taking the time to reply!

Yes, it'd be a science PhD.

Thanks for your reply - it helped a lot! I was worried that I might start liking it and not like it towards the end, or run over by years or something like that.

Sounds like you're having a great time - best of luck with the remainder of your studies, sounds like you're doing really well so far :)

Thanks again for taking the time to reply!

======= Date Modified 08 Mar 2012 09:19:34 =======
=== POST REPLACED ===

Ages ago, I wrote the following blog based on my experiences of a PhD. I was asked plenty questions by prospective students, so created said blog to help them.

http://www.wearthesis.talktalk.net

1) Annual stipend for a funded PhD is roughly equivalent to minimum wage these days, but competition is hefty. I only got £8,000 a year when I did it. You may get an additional industrial sponsorship if a commecial organisation is interested in your project, though this may mean extra work on your part (i.e. regular reports and presentation of information).

2) I looked after various kit in my department and did some informal student supervision towards the end and into post-doc. This I did not get paid for as I elected not to formally do extra duties (tipped off not to due to workload).

3) Once properly underway, up until the end of the experimental period (science-based PhD) I guess ~9 hours a day (not including a little home-based work). However, this would increase if I was preparing for a conference or involved in paper preparation. During write-up I did some seriously long hours and I spent two years doing 12 to 16 hour days (weekends included - gaps in experimental work had to be filled in as well).

4) My supervisor normally saw me 4 or 5 times a week. He kept a close watch on projects, however, I got autonomy to push a substantial chunk of the project in a direction I thought would get substantial results. He went off on his own tangent and it all worked out quite well in the end.

5) I tried to join the athletics union, however, injury ended that plan. I also tried to take a German language course, however, workload ended that after the first year.

6) Initially, yes. I did a first post-doc in the department where I did my PhD (overlap of PhD into post-doc due to write-up - fairly normal). The second post-doc at another university saw that come off the rails (project leader had poor people skills) and because of the second post-doc, I appreciate the problems others have posted up on here (supervision, lack of direction, conflict with colleagues, etc.). I'm back in the real world at a lower level than before the PhD (the second post-doc did a lot of damage).

7) Yes, I thoroughly enjoyed the PhD even though the hours were killers at times. I got to do things and use some cool pieces of equipment I never though I'd get the chance to. I would not do anything different if I had the time over again and would still do the PhD if placed back in time and offered the chance to reconsider my choices. I would, however, not have taken the second post-doc if I had my time over again. But that's hindsight for you.

8) Work to study (science-based role to PhD, not consultancy) was straight forward for me. The one real problem was changing my writing style to an academic one (i.e. short report with basic facts to extended report with reference information). Going back to the real world and a fast paced job after the second post-doc I'm finding harder. A PhD does affect your mindset and approach.

9) I overran by about a year. It is possible to finish on time if you're structured in approach with given predetermined goals reached by certain fixed deadlines. However, the nature of a PhD is you're very likely to change direction due to new findings as you go along and your projected time scales thus become meaningless. I would say more people overrun than don't. Bear in mind you don't get funded during the overrun period unless you start a post-doc whilst you're finishing (and you have that work to do as well as your PhD write-up).

I have heard of early submissions, however, if you hear of people passing with minor corrections after two years you almost certainly have to be talking about a certified genius. Some Universities forbid submission before two and a half years.


Hope that's of help to you.


Ian (Mackem_Beefy)

Hi there,

I get £14000 as the Doctoral Training Centre is funded by the EPSRC.
Applicants are told after interview if they would get one of the 10 allocated places of fees paid and a stipend.

I do not have time to work on top of the PhD because...
...in my department we are expected to spend 10 hours per week day on our work.
we are expected to be in the office or lab for nine hours per week day.

I see my supervisor one to one once per week with a 30 minute time slot.
Group meeting is 1-2 hours per week for more general issues in the whole group and presentations.
I have a post-doc on hand for day to day queries, however my supervisor regularly has pointed out I can see her more if needed at times.

I try and join in time to time with uni out of work things but have a family so this limits me, however, others without partners or children join in loads of things.

Having seen how hard the academics work I am not sure if I want a career progression that is more hours per day than I am doing currently. No idea what I will do post PhD. Lots of opportunity to network, so if I do go post-doc route will have knowledge of other groups and suitable references.

On the whole I enjoy my PhD. The times I don't enjoy it are when things don't work and I wonder what on earth will go in the thesis at the end. I also find the work load a struggle - the last thing I want to do after 10 hours in the lab is an hour or two reading the latest papers at home.

I worked for many years before PhD. Going from a seven hour work day to a ten hour day was not easy. Gradually getting used to it now.

I see no reason why I shouldn't finish on time (or within 3 months of end). My supervisor is already following my work to ensure I will have suitable results to present in the thesis. I am already thinking about my thesis and how I will write up methods used so far, literature review in introduction (very rough drafts) etc. One reason people need extra time is because they leave the writing too late. Writing bits early gives practice and takes away some of the writers block (or having to remember what you did 18 months previous).

Hi there.

I think a PhD is a great thing to do, but it is a commitment, and it's nothing like being an undergraduate, so do be aware that you won't be reliving your undergraduate days if you decide to do one!

My annual stipend is about £13,000 a year (tax free) - that's about £1100 a month. I originally applied for an EPSRC funded project, but at interview it became clear that the project wasn't quite right for me, so someone with more specific expertise got that funding and they offered me an additional place funded by the university (they loved the ideas I had for continuing research based on my Masters dissertation). In my first year I was teaching a couple of modules at another university (I'd been doing that for a couple of years before I started the PhD) but realised it was getting in the way of my PhD so I dropped that teaching at the end of my first year. There hasn't been an opportunity to do any other extra paid work since, and to be honest, I don't think I'd have had the time anyway.

I try to work 9 to 5, but some days I do less and some days I do a lot more. When I have a deadline I often work much longer hours, e.g. 14 hour days, and over weekends, but I think having time off and a life outside the PhD is important to recharge your batteries, be fresh and effective, and to maintain your sanity!

I see my supervisors for regular meetings, usually a couple of times a month for about an hour at a time, but more often if there's a particular need for it. I'm seeing them a little less often now than I did in the beginning (I'm in my third year now).

I'm not at all involved in the life of the university. I commute from another city to attend, so only go onto campus twice a week. PhD students in my department who live near campus do seem to spend more time mixing socially, but generally most people are not involved in societies or other uni things - they are much more for undergraduates, or for taught postgrads. Being a mature student makes things slightly different though. I was working for 15 years before I started my PhD. It's very different to work - took me ages to get used to the idea that I didn't need to justify what I was doing every day, or that I could attend or not attend, or take time off, as I saw fit. Otherwise, it's been sheer luxury - it feels like such freedom after being in proper employment!

I'm hoping to go on to a Post-doc in my department, but it all depends on funding bids being successful. If that doesn't come off I'm not sure what I'll do - look to other universities for work, hopefully nearby. I'd much rather stay in academia but I know it's very hard to find work, so if I have to I'll look at other kinds of jobs. Hopefully I'll find something where the PhD is beneficial but who knows! Overall, though, I love my PhD. There are times when it's frustrating, and hard work, and I'd rather be down the pub with my mates than working late into the night, of course, but overall this has been a stimulating and rewarding experience. My funding runs out in October and I'm really hoping to finish by then, possible submitting in the summer (and then spending the last few weeks writing journal articles while I prepare for viva) although things are taking slightly longer than I anticipated so that plan may have slipped slightly!

Hope these comments help you decide what you want to do!

======= Date Modified 11 Mar 2012 23:36:43 =======
======= Date Modified 11 Mar 2012 23:34:40 =======
Hi Madbiscuit, I totally agree with Batfink that a PhD is nothing like MSc or undergrad which were when uni was actually enjoyable. However this is different for everyone as people have different PhD experiences. Doing a PhD is like having a job in that you are responsible for your own project and have to ensure you get the results needed to write up. You get a lot of freedom as to how you do that as research is an independent thing that you have to manage which can be very stressful. Have you thought about what it is that you don't like about your current job and how you think a PhD will compare? A suggestion could be to write a list and see what appears on it. Can you achieve job satisfaction by changing jobs or is it the whole sector you don't like? I'm suggesting this as the decision to do a PhD is a big one and you should be aware of the reasons you want to do one as you need lots of motivation for the tough times so you need to be prepared.

In answer to your questions:

1) The annual stipend depends on the discipline and source of funding. Science PhDs funded by research councils get a stipend of £12-13 k (tax-free) with more in London due to London weighing. If there is an external sponsor (e.g. another institution, industrial sponsor) besides the research council as in the case of CASE studentships you will get a few k more but they are not that common. Most unis set the uni funded studentships at the same rate but they may vary depending on the uni/dept that is offering the funding. As with the case of Sci students a lot of projects come with funding attached but there are also some where is an open competition. There is a list of projects that you can apply for or you can propose your own and one/a few of those projects will get funded so you won't know until afterwards if you've been successful. You should ask anyway as the dept/uni may try to help you get funding.

2) This depends on the dept and how much work there is available. This can range from taking tutorials, demonstrating, marking coursework, exam invigilation etc... The pay varies depending on the level of work eg. ~£25 per hour for teaching, ~£12 for demonstrating and ~£6 for exam invigilation. It's best to ask what the policy is as some depts do not give students a lot of opportunities to get involved whereas others do. There maybe other opportunities to earn money by taking part as test subjects in other research projects in other depts e.g. psychology, physiology. The other factor is to consider how much time you have as these activities ca be time consuming.

3) I did about ~9 hours of lab work and did computer work in the evenings. I also worked a lot of weekends in the lab too though not sure I could do it again!

4) The answer to this is how long is a piece of string? This depends on your supervisor, how interested they are in your work and their style of supervision! The dept put in procedures whereby we were supposed to have monthly meetings which we were suppose to minute and file with the dept! However, these turned out to be a joke as the onus was on the student so if the supervisor was uncooperative it was rather difficult. I was lucky if I saw my supervisor that often and had to get quite creative with the minutes using any contact time as a "meeting!"

5) I started off getting involved but as my workload was very heavy I didn't have the time to do so! Not many people did as someone said before they were aimed more at undergrads and PhDs seemed a forgotten lot! I mostly socialised with people in the dept which was good once it was up and running! Doing a PhD is a very lonely process and people often feel isolated esp as the start so it's a good idea to get out and do stuff.

Sorry it didn't fit into one post ...

6) It's very hard to get a job in academia at the mo as there seems to be an oversupply of PhDers looking for limited post-docs and lectureships! Everyone seems to have already had a position with lots of papers when you go and apply for your 1st one! That's a real pain as you wonder how you'll ever compete and get in there! I considered other jobs in consultancies and other agencies where I could use my skills but I found them too limited so I'm going to keep trying as I'd really like to do research in academia!

7) I didn't enjoy my PhD much mainly due to my supervisor who was difficult and didn't show much interest in my work. There was also a lack of supervision and support which I think would have meant some problems could've been resolved earlier than they were which hindered my progress. It was a very frustrating process especially as I had problems with data collection so things took longer than planned. On the positive side I'm glad I survived and made friends which is always good. I know how to handle things in the future and feel that anything is possible particularly flexibility within the subject.

8) I worked in various jobs before starting some researched related positions so I knew what I had let myself in for and it still wasn't what I expected! Once you get past the stage of not believing you have got onto a PhD you knuckle down and do some work it's OK and you settle in pretty quickly.

9) I didn't expect to finish within the allocated time due to the problems with data collection which became apparent quite early on so we needed to adjust the project and try to get enough data and expand it in new directions which was good as it allowed me to do more stuff I had expected to do. In science most people go over the allocated time as experiments often have a mind of own or you find some interesting data that leads you to new areas etc... It often all comes together at the end when you analyse and interpret the data which can be time consuming too.

I hope this helps. One other thing to note is the difference in income so you'll have to live like a student again unless you have some stashed away which'll help when you are writing up. Good luck with your decision.

(up) :-)