======= Date Modified 12 Apr 2012 06:24:46 =======

Many thanks to everyone here

Hi WG,
I'm sorry you feel so low. You say you passed your upgrade, not something that everybody achieves. Is it worth trying to write an overview of what you've done over the 2 years? Even an outline of what you've done might help to give a little perspective and allow you to see where you're at.
Here's a mince pie to try to warm your spirits on a cold Sunday night! (mince)
Mog

======= Date Modified 12 Apr 2012 06:26:25 =======
Thanks Mog

Sounds like a crappy place to be :( I can't really offer any advice but your situation sounds kind of similar to mine..

A few months ago I tried to quit my phd; it was going nowhere and I accepted that if I stayed to finish it I would become more and more depressed and unhealthy, all for the sake of a phd I didn't desperately want. My supervisor, too, became emotional and unreasonable and in the end I stayed (it was funded, though, otherwise I'd have been out the door like a shot!)

Unsurprisingly, 5 months later I've got nowhere with the phd and I've allowed it to eat me up. It seems that this time around I will be allowed to leave, since it has become apparent that I'm not magically coming up with a thesis I never thought I'd be capable of writing. I haven't decided whether or not I'll continue with it; having allowed it to sink me so low I now think it shouldn't get any worse and I feel like I at least want something out of it, but I have no idea how to write a thesis on a topic I have such a minimal understanding of. My supervisor's made it clear that I've had more than enough help and a very positive experience from the outset, and that if I haven't written a thesis then it is as a result of my own stubborn refusal to do so.

You say you aren't sure if you can finish; is it a lack of desire, ability or both? If you have the desire, can you overcome the other problems? If you lack the desire, then what's keeping you there and is it worthwhile? I'm sure you've thought about those things a lot already, but I guess in the end they'll be the deciding factors.

I also have a supervisor who is very busy and generally rubbish when it comes to the whole 'supervising' thing. I'd encourage you not to be too disheartened by a supervisor like that, there's no reason why you can't finish a phd with such a useless supervisor (I've seen enough people do it, though I have no idea how). At the same time, if this is one of the main obstacles in the way of completing your phd then it may be one there is no way around (unless you could change supervisors).

Anyway, best of luck. As I've been telling myself since last September: whatever happens, at least in 'x' months it will all have finished (one way or another) and by then it will be nothing to worry about for the rest of your life! Maybe this is BS to you but the important things in life are family, friends, any passions or interests you've managed to keep throughout the phd... these are the things that will make life worth living and stave off the depression that things like phds will cause you.

Hi Woodengiraffe,

It sounds to me like you have to be brutally honest with yourself and decide if you think you will ever be able to get your phd. If the answer is no, then in my opinion it would be best to quit now, rather than drag it out any longer (easier said than done, I'm sure!). I never like to give up on things so I can imagine how difficult this must be, but if it is making you depressed and unhappy then I think it would be for the best in the long run. When you think about quitting, how does it make you feel? If you feel excited about the prospect of not having to face your phd anymore, then perhaps you have your answer!!

I live away from uni and work at home alot, so I know it can be isolating and make things more difficult. I definitely feel that I get much less support from my supervisors than other students as I am not there in front of them everyday. I also struggled to get motivated because of this and also because I don't *love* my topic. I like it, but it is not something I am passionate about. However, after drifting through my first 2 years, in my third year everything just sort of came together and now I am weeks away from submitting and feeling much happier about it.

Please don't feel like you have 'failed' in any way if you choose not to complete - nobody knows when they start their phd how hard it will be and if the interest they had in their subject at the beginning will last. I actually think it's braver to admit it isn't working for you and quit than to struggle on with something just because you feel you have to.

Is there anyone else at the uni you can talk to about things apart from your supervisor? Maybe even some fellow students who you could have a bit of a moan to might make you feel better?

Hope some of this waffle has helped in some way! And whatever you decide, I wish you the best of luck.

======= Date Modified 20 Jan 2012 18:20:49 =======
...

Hey woodengiraffe (love the name - I'm actually imagining a toy wooden giraffe as I write this!), try not to get too stressed about the perceived lack of solid writing you have so far. When I was starting my third year, I had only one chapter written - and even that needed re-writing. I also had to collect and analyse about a third of my data during my third year as well. You must have notes and papers, you have a head full of two years worth of thoughts that have been maturing and you more than have the ability to complete if you so wish (two masters degrees!).

A PhD doesn't require a genius but, as you know, it requires a lot of slogging. As health takes priority, if it is truly making you depressed then you know what to do. As for motivation, have you considered that has been a big investment of time and effort and also money (lost earnings and course costs)? This may be a spur for motivation. The difficulty concentrating that you refer to is typical of what I went through. Setting deadlines and feeling the 'pressure' helped me with this. Like you, my PhD sent me mad - but the relief I felt when I finally handed mine in was worth it. As for feeling that you're writing is poor, we're often our harshest critics. On top of this, writing is something that rarely ever comes out perfect first time. It's often this lump of rock that has little gems in, and it requires a lot of refinement to get it up to standard.

As for worrying about failing the eventual viva or receiving major correction, this is perfectly natural. In fact, I'd go so far as to say that any PhD student that hasn't thought about this is just plain cocky! In fact, my internal examiner hated my thesis - she even told me so in person, saying that if she was the external she'd have made me re-write it. Fortunately, the external really like it, had an argument with the internal at the time and ensured that I got only minor corrections. It's horses for courses at this level, and one man's apple is another's Brussel sprout. For this reason, externals and internals are (usually) chosen carefully to ensure that they can fully 'appreciate' your work.

Sorry if it seems like I'm playing devil's advocate. To weigh things up... You have the capacity, you must have a lot of the pieces (at least, more than you realise) and you're supervisor believes in you. But, you feel unmotivated, feel down about the process, don't like the solitude and worry about your ability. Ultimately, only you can choose. Know that you're not the only person that has faced difficulties such as this - you'll find loads of threads on this forum written by people who have faced a similar situation. Some people actually started their own thesis completion thread, setting targets and goals, using it for mutual motivation and encouragement. Other people set up threads to rationalise their decisions to leave their PhDs and receive support during the process. I wish you luck whatever decision you arrive at.

Apologies for the typos- temporary insomnia and fatigue coupled with having to be up again in a matter of 4 hours!

======= Date Modified 12 Apr 2012 06:25:46 =======
Many thanks for all replies and advice and comments.

Why not post on the one goal thread if you lose motivation? Chin up, work hard and you'll get there!

======= Date Modified 19 Jan 2012 22:11:20 =======
======= Date Modified 19 Jan 2012 22:10:27 =======

I saw your recent update that you have decided to stick with the PhD. Would you mind elaborating a little on how you arrived at that decision? I'm also in my 3rd year and really struggling, with very little written yet. I have very low motivation, but I think a lot of that stems from feeling intellectually way out of my depth (not being able to understand the material or write at the required standard). People don't seem to believe me though and I keep getting told that doing a PhD is just about slogging it out and there seems to be an assumption that because I started it, I must be clever enough to finish it. I appreciate this aspect might not apply to you so much, but I'm sure hearing some of your thought process would be helpful, if you want to share. Thanks.