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======= Date Modified 14 Aug 2011 16:04:46 =======
Hey,
I am in the final stages of my Masters in Anthropology in the U.K. and thought about continuing with a PhD afterwards. However, I would have to take out a loan to fund it if there won#t be any research council funding. I calculated the rate I would have to pay back after finishing the PhD, which would be c. 390 GBP per month. Is this possible to pay such a rate after one (or two years) after you gained an (Oxbridge) PhD in the above mentioned field or is it unrealistic? I am single and there are no children, if it matters.

thanks,
Tim

Hey Tim! Personally I just wouldn't go there. The job market is very tough, as I'm sure you know, and there is absolutely no guarantee of a job after your PhD. I don't know much about anthropology, but it will be one of the tougher subjects to get a job in afterwards, since most of the jobs/funding are geared towards science subjects, and even the jobs in those subjects are horribly tough to get. I think you'll end up being under an awful lot of pressure to pay that back, probably with no income, at least for a while. But others might have different opinions! Best, KB

I'd echo Keenbean's advice in every respect. If I was in your position Tim I wouldn't even dream of self-funding a full-time PhD. Not only might you not get an academic job, but you might find that having a PhD makes it harder for you to get any job. People often write on here that hiding their PhDs on their CVs gets them further in the job hunt stakes!

Now a part-time PhD might be a different option. If you could fit that alongside a nearly full-time job then the outlay would be much less. And it is very common in some fields (such as humanities - my area) to self-fund a part-time PhD. But even then you have to weigh up the benefits. And I wouldn't recommend thinking in terms of how much a completed PhD would earn you. Quite possibly nothing. Quite possibly even in negative terms.

======= Date Modified 15 Aug 2011 11:01:02 =======
Hey

thanks for the advice. However, if I would not plan to go into academia afterwards but something like consultancy would this alter something? I mean that most phd students I knwo from Oxford (also in anthropology) had jobs quit after they finished their phd. I don't no how one is exactly taxed in this situation in the U.K. but shouldn't be 30k/ year be enough to pay this back? And why woudl nobdy self-fund a phd, just becaus it is so pricy? I have soem of teh funds to do the phd already but would need additional money from a loan.

tim

As I said, I don't know much about your subject or any kind of consultancy work that you might wish to take up, but in the 3 years since I started my PhD things have got a lot tougher, and most people come out of PhDs (no matter what the subject or which university it was) with no job. Some people do manage to get a job, but many struggle in terms of either academic or non-academic jobs, and people can go for years even without finding something. I have just managed to secure a 1-year contract for a post-doc, for which I will earn just over £30k. But I would not want to be losing £400 per month on top of rent and other living costs....it might just about be possible, but it would be very tight. Best, KB

hey

thanks for your advice in the thread I opened. Nevertheless, you said that the struggle for post-doc positions is really though in the moment. However, do you think that it really does not matter from which university one comes? When I started at Oxford, we were told that one shoudl -normally- have better career prospects in one intended field of work (academia) than others.

tim

No an Oxbridge PhD is not going to help you particularly in the academic job market - the cachet might help with non-academic jobs if they don't object to the PhD as others have already mentioned. You would be better waiting and trying to secure funding. You will like everyone else be predominantly judged on what you have published, taught, funding gained etc rather than the institution attended. In fact, as very few Oxbridge PhD students get the seminar / lecture teaching experience increasingly expected by academic employers, they can be at a slight disadvantage. It's not like the USA where the institution is the most important factor.

Here is what I said earlier to someone who posed a similar question
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I would think VERY carefully about this.

If you're doing it as a career move - consider whether this is really going to help you. Many academic fields are over saturated with PhD graduates and jobs are very hard to come by. Recent PhD completers who have looked outside academia for work have reported that the PhD can be as much of a hindrance as a help. Do some research into what the prospects are like in your field. If you think a PhD will be genuinely likely to help then could you wait until a funded opportunity arises?

If you're doing this because it's an interest/passion - consider whether you could carry on your interest as a hobby, or find a job that allows you to dabble a bit. There's nothing stopping you pursuing this as a PhD in 5, 10, 20 years time when the funding situation may be more amenable and the job market better.

Essentially consider whether 3 years of full time effort with no financial recompense and no guarantee of a job or enhanced career prospects at the end of it is worth the sacrifices. Sorry if this sounds harsh but reality is that this is probably the worst time ever to choose a full time self-funded PhD.
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In your case I would add that I don't think institution matters *that* much - it's one of many factors along with publications, networking and grants that build up your academic reputation. I'm also not entirely sure what your motivation for doing this is if you're already giving serious thought to working in consultancy afterwards, rather than academia. I don't know much about consultancy work but my instinct is that an employer would probably rather choose someone with 3 years relevant work experience than an anthropology PhD when employing a consultant.