Read this srticle:

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/526107.stm

I think the farmers name says it all - describes what an a*shole he is.

Mapleleaf, I am disgusted at your insensitive comments. Of course Mink are cute. Look at their little faces. Cows are as well. I'll give you chickens, they aren't particularly cute, as adults anyway. The fluffy chicks are cute.

Someone, Jen I think, has a really cute chicken called fluffy (I think).

Personally, I think goats are lovely, I would like a couple if I ever get a job and a big enough house with a reasonable sized garden

H- you want to share your future house with goats???? Well, lets hope your future garden is big enough for your boyfriend, goats can be smelly and bossy- just like Men. And they don't wash.

Oh, and LAMBS ... ah, now they're cute!

Quite right - animal testing ok. But the wearing of fur is totally unnecessary. Besides, most people look like utter w*****s in fur.

Dan,

Its a difficult one, because, as far as I can see, there is no obvious qualitative difference between farming a load of mink for fur, and farming pigs for bacon. (assuming both animals are kept in similar conditions.

For me its partly a scale issue: 40 odd mink for the sake of 1 coat vs. 1 pig for 1000 rashers of bacon (or whatever). I also think its a matter of respect. For me, keeping animals well before killing them and eating them gives them an honourable death (many will disagree). Sowing them to their mates and wearing them around the place is a bit grotesque in my opinion.

I do agree though that there is a certain level of hypocrisy shown by many people who hate the fur trade but are happy to plod around in leather shoes and scoff bacon butties.

I know what you mean, but here's my take on it.

Firstly, injecting with toxins. We need to do toxicity testing to work out safe doses to give to humans for tests. Therefore, assuming you think that it's preferable for animals to die than humans to die, this is ok.

Eating animals. I agree with you on this. It's not totally necessary. But I think humans are omnivores, although it's perfectly possible to survive on a vegetarian, and even vegan, diet. So I agree, the logic is flawed with eating animals.

But surely it can't be debated that, out of testing (drugs, not spurious cosmetics), eating, and wearing animals or animal products, the wearing of them is by far the least necessary, and also the most easily replaced by non-animal methods.

I agree with the dog eating point - while it may be cute, it's still an animal, and eating a dog is no different to eating or using any other animal product.

But then we're not at all a logical species are we? There are so many things we do which are illogical - isn't this just one of the peculiarities of humans?

Well, if you are of the opinion that killing animals is wrong then, yes thats logical. Personally, I believe in using animals as a resource for food, clothing etc. but I also believe in showing them respect and minimising cruelty. For me, killing a cow that can feed a massive amount of people and using the skin for leather etc. is OK. Killing 40 mink to make an expensive coat is not.

Paul McCartney once raised an interesting point on this. Imagine how much grain is required to feed one pig through it's lifetime till its day of slaughter, and how that grain could otherwise be used.

That said, there is more than enough food in the world to feed everyone already. It's just how we distribute it that's the issue.

Maybe Paul McCartney should have said "Think of how much money a man can make through selling music. Then think of what that money could do for the Third World". There's hypocrisy for you.

Now there's a hot one. I mean I really like U2 but when I do wonder about Bono's moral position sometimes.

I'd pay money to be spared Geldof. I really cannot stand the man.

Precisely. I mean, I don't mind people being well off, but when they're so obscenely well off through nothing but making music, and then they have the gall to spout on about how not very well off people should give some of their cash to charity? Pot, kettle, and black methinks.