======= Date Modified 18 21 2009 07:21:52 =======
======= Date Modified 18 28 2009 04:28:48 =======
Part 1 - Sorry for writing too much, but honestly even these words are not enough to describe my situation right now.

I've just got into a PhD program at the local university, and boy, the process of getting into the program alone is a story on its own.

So, our President decided to stop all MPhil applications for this year(and the years to come, I fear) to force all applicants to enroll PhD to boost PhD student numbers in hopes of getting better world rankings among other universities (Times Higher Education Rankings anyone?). So when graduate school called me, I had pretty much no choice but to surrender and changed my application to a PhD.

Initially, my goal for applying an MPhil was to basically lay low for awhile until the effects of the economic crisis took a better turn. Of course, and the addition of getting a research postgraduate degree within two years wouldn't hurt my CV either. But to be honest, I'm not too passionate about research work or my field.

Pre-crisis the employment rate for graduates from my program was acceptable, which is surprising since the industry/field is not reallythat popular here. Now pro-crisis, however, the prospects look grim and a lot of us still struggle to find a job.

I, in particular, am anxious to get a job to pay the bills and to respond to my family's cries to soothe their economic burden. After a couple of job interviews (and the “thanks, but no thanks” replies), I decided then to accept the PhD offer because of the offered studentship. My first year studentship is paid out of my supervisor's pockets (from his research funds), while the later years by fundingsfrom other parties.

Now it's been some time after the registration, and I'm beginning to see the problems with the PhD program as I start my work. The endless research paper reading (pretty much standard to all postgrads I guess),the constant dread of finding a good thesis topic and the endless meetings is really starting to get to me. My supervisor is already introducing (or should I say pushing) me to other faculty members to do future collaborative works. In addition to all this, I've got courses to attend and undergrads to supervise. I see why people say that PhDs are only for those that are serious about research.

I think I could force myself and grind through all of this to get the degree, but then I fear I would be overqualified for most jobs out there and be stuck with doing postdoc and other research work at the university.

Part 2 - Continued
I'm starting to reconsider this entire PhD affair. On one hand I could just endure for four years (since I have no interest at all for research work) and hopefully get a PhD, but would be prone to be stuck in the university (and thus more research). On the other, I could drop out for a job, forfeiting the postgrad degree. My family suggested that I continue to go both ways, that is, to continue my PhD until I get a job for the studenship; of course, I should find a job and quit ASAP if I don't want to waste anymore of my supervisor's money. Also, I would enrage faculty members by suddenly pulling myself out from collaborative projects.

If I continue PhD, I know I wouldn’t be very happy in the situation but get the postgrad degree. If I drop immediately, I would risk being unemployed for months to come and it would really put pressure on my family and myself financially. If I go “double-agent”, I would look like a no-good jerk that basically betrayed my supervisor’s trust.

What should I do?

Hi Endph_Sien

There's been a couple of other posts lately from people who are starting out and have grave doubts - you might want to look at those too. It sounds like a really difficult situation and I don't envy you your hard decisions. When it comes down to it tho, it sounds like you really want a job and would take one, if any were available. Could you work in a different area while still looking for a job to come up in your field?

Some people are not passionate about their research, but I think most are, and if you already know that you don't like research work, don't do a PhD. 3 or 4 years is a long time to do something you know you don't want to do right from the start. Even people who love doing their PhDs find it hard, and if you don't like it, I think you'd run a real risk of not completing, which wouldn't help your career at all. Then you're assuming that if you did get the PhD, you'd get a post doc etc - this is harder than it sounds!! And would a uni give a post-doc to someone who doesn't want to do research? Doubtful. I think doing a PhD as a back-up plan, just for the money, doesn't have good odds of success. And I think you're right about not just doing it till something else came along - the funding should go to someone who really wants to do the project, to the finish.

And is it too late to apply to another uni to do an MPhil?

Good luck with your decision.

I think you should be free.. there are a lot of opportunities in our working carieers..(even in time of crisis) try to find something for you.. (up) or.. after 5-10 years you will become a worthless gumbler with hated working place. (down)

======= Date Modified 18 Aug 2009 07:59:04 =======
I think you should immediately quit.

I say this for two reasons. First, clearly, you never wanted to do research in the first place. You hadn't an academic bent of mind, your best reasons for at all getting into postgrad study were A) it wouldn't hurt and B) you wanted to lie low for a bit. I have no personal experience of either of these two feelings, so I cannot say how strong they could be in pushing one through a degree. So if these were your reasons and you now find yourself hating it, do leave. Although I should add, there are many who are not passionate about their topics and have a range of similar or stronger (economic) reasons to get into a phd, all of which are very valid reasons by themselves.

Second, however, this is a situation where an academic is investing his (hard-earned) research funding. Research funding involces bid preparation, constructive work, repeated rejections at times, bid re-preparation, re-submission in certain cases, and massive collabortive work towards a common goal, of which a phd studentship is a constructive part. This is also a situation where that academic has considered it worth their and their collegaues' while to induct you into the research circle. Third, this academic hasn't a clue (unless he, like any intelligent supervisor has figured it out by now) that he is investing funds, resources and thought on someone who is hating the very things (the degree, the projects, the networks) that any research oriented student would kill for!

I think, that is unfair. This space could go to a student who wants it, who will thrive in a collaborative research atmosphere, and use this well as a launching pad into their future career.

Of course you need to decide, but if I were you, I would quit immediately, the only consideration being organizing some kind of a job first.

best, bug.

Can I also just say, I can't understand people doing a PhD for the money. What money??!!? Sure, it's more than unemployment benefits, but where I am, it's not even minimum wage! By the time someone has the quals/intelligence to do a PhD, they could earn more doing anything else. The money argument has me beat...although maybe other countries provide more funding...

I definitely agree with what everyone else here has said. I wouldn't necessarily say this to anyone else asking if they should quit (I actually just wrote a blogpost on my own decision to stay that will be put up soon at www.phddepression.com - it's funny how the threads on this site always seem to correspond to exactly what's on my mind), but get out now.

If you already know, so early into the program, that you dislike research and don't want to be in academia after this then you're "lucky". A lot of people (myself included) don't realize/accept that fact until they've invested a lot of time and emotion into a program. In that case, for people with not much further to go, I'd generally say to just try to stick it out. But it is going to be a really long 4+ years for you.

I disagree that you have to quit immediately though. Yes there may be other people who could fill your position, but it's already almost September so I doubt that it would happen this semester anyway. If you stay, you'll have to start working overtime. Don't slack on your research work, you owe it to your supervisor to do good work while you're there, but every night when you go home spend a few hours pulling yourself together and applying for whatever it is you want to do next. It's not sneaky to do this, no one expects a person to quit anything without having the next thing lined up. Just make sure to give your supervisor some advanced notice when it's time for you to leave and offer to (within reason) finish out any project that you'd be leaving in the lurch.

Good luck.

I invested one and a half years into my doctorate before I quit. I got on fine with MSc modules I had to take (almost straight As) but when it came to the research side of things, I was pulling my hair out. I dragged it out for one month and then could handle it no longer. I WAS going to keep going for the money but quickly realised that it would never work out and would only make me more depressed. 3-4 years is a LONG time... do what's right for you. It honestly sounds like you should just get a job - that's what I'm aiming for. You may find that if you see the PhD through, you'd be considered overqualified for a lot of jobs - probably the last thing you'd want, right?
Although I'm still mildly stressed about getting a job, so much has been lifted off my shoulders after having quit. For me, it was THE best decision to make - I felt so true to myself for having quit. It was gruelling, though - I had to tell at least 5 people who were in charge and it almost felt like a life or death decision. Keep this in mind - don't get too far in if you don't like those kind of confrontations!
Offering balance, a lot of people are really suited to doing a PhD. You'll know if you're that sort of person. Send a pm if you wish and good luck with whatever you decide to do.

Well firstly, I imagine you could have gone to another university and started the MPhil if that is what you wanted, but secondly, I can't understand why you have taken on something for which you need a bit of passion-no actually a lot of passion - to get through, but you appear not to have this for the subject. No PhD is a walk in the park, it has a large element of very hard work and you need something to keep you going (other than chocolate :$ ) and is not a soft option by any means. It looks like your supervisor assumes you are eager to get going and is helping you to get started, the kind of help that some people on here wish they had, and you are making a bit of a fool of him at the moment - and thus will be affecting every student he somes across in the future.

you should leave as soon as you can, get job hunting in earnest and let someone else have your place. In the meantime work as hard as you can to leave as good an impression as possible for those who will follow you.

======= Date Modified 18 Aug 2009 10:33:40 =======

Hmm... are you in the UK Sue? I'd guess a tax-free research council scholarship of £13000ish is roughly equivalent to the take-home pay of someone earning £17,000 or so - maybe a bit more, depending on pension contributions etc. I think there are plenty of graduates earning that sort of money or less, especially early in their careers (I certainly did!)

Plus studentships have other perks for certain people. For instance: because a scholarship's not taxable, it doesn't count as income for tax credits purposes; so as a parent with a working partner, I reckon our family income with me on a mere £13000 studentship is about the same as it would be if I was in a job paying around £24,000.

Oh, and by my calculations someone aged over 22, working a 48-hour week for minimum wage, would be around £100 a month worse off than a research council funded PhD student after tax and NI.

Very well put Joyce! I myself was and still am slightly miffed about the original post...why? Not because of the OP's dilemma for which they will work a solution out...but the sheer 'playfulness' with which this is being done looks unacceptable to me! If I were to enter industry today, for I felt it was the best way in which to lie low, that's fine I would hate it, and then that would be fine too, but I would re-consier leading a helpful colleague/boss down blind alleys.

I work with a scholar who has fast inducted me into the research world where I see the amount of hard work that's going behind a single grant/funding proposal let alone the project itself and the answerability it demands. Paying intl fees, I am stitching togethe multiple jobs, scholarships this and that to survive. So perhaps, this 'waste' of things annoys me more than it ordinarily would!

======= Date Modified 18 Aug 2009 10:54:44 =======
Regards graduate jobs - my first paid £28k and is still quite high (hopefully it'll last for a while longer!). Much more than my PhD monies! I have a friend who is a printer, works 7 hours a day and gets £35k for it - if he works overtime he can clear £50k easily, and he left school in 5th year! IMO there are many more high paying jobs regarding few qualifications than there are lecturing positions which I reckon are more high stress. I'm not trying to put a red mist over anybody here - if you love your PhD then great! But for the OP.. consider that.. I've even considered leaving engineering and going into the police - great pension and decent pay for little intellectual rigour. My sort of job lol!

======= Date Modified 18 Aug 2009 14:05:15 =======
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I wouldn't worry too much about the ethics of all this stuff. I think some people take this stuff a bit too seriously. Just keep working until you find a decent job, then give them 2 weeks or whatever notice, and move on.

I would definitely not do any overtime or get involved in too many things you aren't required to do (collaborative research, etc.). I'd advise you to do whatever you're paid for and little or nothing else. Just do what's best for you and don't worry too much about pleasing everyone.

There's lots of people who'd like to be in your place. So while your supervisor might get upset at you leaving, there are probably PLENTY of people who can take your place when you leave.

Which leads me to wonder if it is people like you who don't take all these things seriously/ethically, make the world a nice place, or whether it is the morons who do!