Hi, great site by the way, good to know such a place exists.

Anyway, basically I have a 2.1 in English Language, graduating in July 2007. I thought I'd try my luck out in the big world of work.

Unfortunately, it really isn't going as planned. Hated all the business interviews and such, so decised to get a full time job in a factory and help at a local primary school and apply for PGCEs and SCITTs.

The time at the school as been amazing, but I was rejected by all my applications (4, 2 of which I got interview stage). This has left me feeling very down and re-evaluting what to do next.

More and more, I feel that I made a mistake in not doing PG study, which I got the impression from one of my tutors at uni that she thought I really was good enough to do (particularly in the field of phonology, which I greatly enjoyed). CONTINUED IN OPENING REPLY…

...(CONTINUED) Well, now I'm researching for starting an MA in October 2009, followed by a PhD, at my old uni (which was an amazing uni for linguistics), and apart from my concerns over funding (I have absolutely no form of parental help to depend on), I am even more concerned about the employment opportunites open to PhD graduates.

I think research would suit me best, but what is out there??? I hate my present job, and don't want to even contemplate doing a MA and PhD to only find myself back in another rubbish job!

Sorry, but this doesn't work like that: you cannot enrol on a PhD programme if all you are concerned about are job prospects post completion. People don't do PhDs because of job prospects and if they do, they often fail to even submit a thesis. That's because a PhD is a very complex, difficult thing to do in terms of motivation over a very long period of time, so if there is no burning desire inside of you to do a Ph.D, for the wrong or the right reason, it is unlikely that this is right for you.

Some do this to prove something to themselves, to their parents or to their former school teachers, others do it because they love research, believe in the spirit of science or just want to be intellectually challenged. Regardless of the question whether any of these reasons is appropriate or not, it certainly helps them to get through. On the other hand, quite often those who quit are the ones who only want to improve job prospects or don't know what else to do.

To answer your question, unless you are planning to go into academia or to become a school teacher, I don't believe doing a PhD will increase your position in job interviews.

Tend to agree. A PhD is actually a good way to close doors (unless Academia or some very specific scientific positions are your direction) because employers prefer "malleable", naive graduates who they can shape and train to their organisation's needs. Suffice to say, pay prospects are generally much better WITHOUT a PhD than WITH.

I've said this before on here, but doing an undergrad degree improves your earning power, a Masters slightly improves that still, a PhD rapidly decreases your earning potential. So unless you're doing it for the love of it or for a career in Academia, I wouldn't bother.

a little bit of bulls**t here, careful where you step everybody...

If you were to do the PhD, what kind of job would you be looking for after? If it's still the PGCE teacher training, I would say forget it.

I think you should be trying to find out why your applications failed for the teacher training courses. Get some feedback if you can.

Sylvester is that really so? In which kind of jobs would you say it decreases your earning potential, seriously ANY other than academia? I'm not trying to argue or say you are wrong because I really don't know, I'm just surprised to hear that. Is this definately as a result of people having a PhD putting off employers, or are statistics that way because people with a PhD are more likely to aim for academic, not hugely paying jobs wheras people with eg an MBA are a different kind of person and will go for different (higher paying) jobs? Where can you find these statistics anyway?

The reason I am doing mine is that I have had a career in the commercial world and want to enter academia. The only way I can get my ideal job lecturing is to complete a PhD. That goal in itself is enough to spur me onwards!!

Geez Adem, please don't tell me you went into your PhD thinking it was a passport to riches. It's essentially a qualification for a career in Academia, this is why I'm doing it - certainly not for the money otherwise I would have stayed where I was. There was an article on this in the Guardian a couple of years ago:

http://www.guardian.co.uk/money/2005/jun/18/graduates.postgraduate1

Your earning potential is better with a graduate degree than PhD for 2 reasons:

1) For the 1 in 15 that would pay extra for a Masters or PhD, it's only worth a premium of £2,000. Had you gone into work straight from undergard you'd have easily surpassed the £2,000 over the 3-4 years spent doing the PhD.

2) With a PhD you are no longer a "fresh" graduate, so you end up pigeon-holed into a specific sector. Fine if that pigeon hole is required by an employer, but you are limited. And sure they teach you some transferable skills, but a prospective employer could have sent their fresh grads on whichever training courses they required over the same period.

Of course there are exceptions (I know of one or two, no more), but the stats speak for themselves and as one who used to interview grads when I worked in management consultancy, I know what this view was shared by my directors.

Geez, I thought this was common knowledge!

It is.

Depends what PhD discipline you are in. I can think of several jobs where a PhD gives you chance to earn more. You can't just walk up to an employer and say 'give me more, I have a PhD' but you can place yourself advantageously with a PhD depending on what you decide to do. Maybe you chose the wrong PhD Sylvester?

A PhD will only increase your earning potential in jobs that clearly state that this is a requirement to either start or advance, e.g. some kinds of research e.g. some (nto all) science subjects. If the job does not state the requirement, you are unlikely to benefit from having one. Many employers are wary of PhDs.

I find it hard to believe you have been turned down for teacher training - perhaps English is just oversubscribed. You should definitley find out exactly what has gone on there.

There is a fair bit of anecdotal evidence on here (over the months) of people getting nowhere extremely slowly when trying to trade off their PhD outside academia. I'm all for looking on the bright side/making the best of things but there is much to suggest that a PhD will be of little practical benefit outside ones chosen academic/research field.