Hello everyone! I find this forum very informative and helpful and wonder if I could get some of your perspectives on a phone conversation I just had with a potential employer.

I am currently writing up my thesis but in the process decided to look for jobs as well. I have been reading this forum and know that there's no guarantee of job offer when I finish so I decided to start looking now. I just got off the phone with someone for a potential post starting maybe October - they are flexible with starting dates which suit me fine - and when it came to salary he mentioned that the company being small and looking for people starting in one of their subsidiaries, they are looking at paying PhD chemists a starting of £24,000 p.a. The company is based in Cheshire UK and I'm currently in the South East. I know living standards will be cheaper there compared to where I am, but I thought that was a low salary. My colleagues who've just finished their PhDs in my office mostly started somewhere above this value like £27k+. What do think? Is this a reasonable salary range for a PhD graduate? There's no negotiation.

The price of living in Cheshire will be much cheaper than the South East so it might work out that you have the same amount of disposable income as those getting 27k+ in the South East! I'm guessing there would be progression in the pay too, so I'd take that into consideration. Basically jobs are so hard to come by that I wouldn't turn it down solely on it being a little less than your friends are getting, but if you see similar jobs in the area with higher salaries, maybe you can negotiate.

It sounds too little I agree, but I think that is entry level for a lot of us. Whilst I've seen science postdocs advertised at 30k, the one I got was 26k (also in north), so maybe that's normal and higher salaries will come in the next couple of years. I hope so anyway!

If the role absolutely requires a PhD then £24K is low. Most technical post doc roles I know of are in the £27-32K range as a starting salary, regardless of where they are in the country or whether they are private or public sector. A friend who has just finished a Chem Engineering PhD has been offered £40K+ for an engineering consultancy job in the NW, though she did have prior experience with the company.

Cheshire will probably be cheaper than the SE but do check the specific area - it's also 'Footballer country' and there are some quite fancy/expensive areas.

I find it odd that just because they are 'starting out' they are looking for highly qualified people and paying them quite a way below the going rate. What is the incentive to someone to work there when they could take a research assistant job for more? It makes me wonder how well they know the sector? I would make enquiries as to whether there are yearly increments or any bonus/benefits, or plans to up the pay at a specific point.

I guess if it were me I would keep the option open as a back up plan as it's not a terrible scenario for a 'starter job', but still be keeping my eyes open for better paid roles with more established organisations. But that does rely on you being willing to relocate, and then possibly have to again within a short space of time.

Hi all thanks for your posts. Yes I thought it was quite a low wage for an entry level post for someone with a PhD. I think they are paying graduates - Masters and PhDs - the same salary. I did look at houses there and they are just about cheaper than where I am currently living.

HazyJane, you are right. The 'Footballer country' tag has probably bumped up some of the house prices there. I did ask the guy if there's any possibility of quickly advancing to the next pay level but he won't promise anything. After doing some research, I found out that if I'm paid £24k p.a. my take home pay after tax and NI contributions will be roughly £1600. This doesn't include any pension deductions and the like. I'm not sure how much they deduct for pensions but if I have a car - and was thinking of getting one, and I have to contribute to say a mortgage and household expenses, then I will be in a similar place that I am now with a stipend from my PhD. I know jobs are hard to come by but I don't want to make a rushed decision and accept the first job that comes and later regret it. The company itself is about 5 years old and they've already got an established division dealing with a specific disease area. This is their second 'branch' they are opening.

Maybe I should just concentrate on finishing my writing *sigh* and worry about getting a job after. My partner doesn't mind if I don't have a job straight after I've submitted but I just keep having this nagging sense of not being good enough if I don't secure a job after I'm done :(

Oh I forgot to add that the role is 100% lab based.

What is the incentive? Maybe that you can actually work there for more than just 1 or 3 years? Maybe until you retire? ;) If you ask me that is huge incentive that is more valuable than 3 or 4k a year.

You just can't compare positions in academia with industry. I'll also find fancy PhD scholarships where I get paid an awesome salary that they would never pay me as an entry salary in industry but that is just for a few years and these kind of academia positions are often funded buy external sources.

@ cherub

Can't you just live in an apartment at the beginning to lower the living costs a bit? I don't know why you guys all immediately talk about mortgage (maybe you want to change companies after a few years and move again). Your salary will probably increase after some time or you can apply for another position elsewhere if you have some work experience in that company. Makes it definitely easier to find new jobs when you actually worked in a company and not just at the university :)

@Dunham...yes I did think about the experience part and if I do decide to take up the offer, this will be a contributing factor. I guess one major advantage of starting in such an environment is that hopefully in 5-10 years - if I'm still there - I'd be one of the pioneers and who knows how far up the ladder I'd have moved up by then?
Regarding the mortgage, my partner and I would like to get on the property ladder sooner rather than later considering how long it'll take to pay off a mortgage...so say if I am to take up this offer with the intention of staying with the company for a considerable duration, I think it'll be wise to settle down somewhere and be paying a mortgage than renting.
Anyway, I haven't had a proper interview with them yet - only spoke to the HR guy on the phone who said he'll pass my CV to the recruitment manager - maybe he won't because I think I lost my enthusiasm after he mentioned the salary and it may have come across in my voice. If I do get a concrete offer then I'll have a good think about it. I've sent a few speculative CVs to a few pharma industries here in the east so will see how that goes. Fingers crossed!

I'd agree if (i) it was a long established company one could be confident of progressing through and (ii) if there was a lot of variation in starting salary for technical-based positions requiring a PhD. But this is an outlier in terms of salary and doesn't sound like there is a well-established career structure within the company. I would query their approach to valuing staff skill sets, particularly if they can afford to open a second branch.

@cherub, you're right not to just jump in and take it because it is the first job that has come along. I would still, as I said, consider it as a 'starter job' that might be interesting and give you some experience, but consider it as a potentially shortish term option (up to 18 months). I definitely wouldn't buy a house on the basis of the assumption I might stay there, and certainly don't see any harm in renting for a while to be sure that one is in the right region/role, but that's just me.

You could earn more/similar in a hosp lab or school/college science technician! That's a low wage for Cheshire. There are a few labs etc in the area.

Hrm having worked in a school as a technician and knowing lots of uni lab techs I'd say they generally don't earn nearly that much! The most I've seen for such positions is about 20k, the least about 13k.

But yeah 24k is a low wage for a PhD of course, and I hope you find something with more. But if you were struggling to find a job 24k isn't a bad wage in the grand scheme of things =)

Hello all. Some update. I've been invited to go up for a face-to-face interview next Tuesday. It was short notice and quite expensive too :(. My original plan was to take the train but it was ridiculously expensive - more than £100! - so I'm going to have to drive up there. Since they haven't mentioned anything about reimbursing me for travel, I've decided to fill up my tank and just drive the long journey up :(

Deep down I know I won't take the job - not unless I can negotiate the pay which from what I've gathered from the phone interview is non-negotiable - but part of me feels I should go through it for the experience as this will be the first proper interview I'd be doing, and I can learn from the experience. I know some will say it's a waste of a day and maybe some precious time preparing for it since I've got writing to do but hey,I feel it'd be a good learning experience :)

Will see how it goes!

@Caro, yes right now I'm not kind of struggling to find a job as I've just negotiated with my supervisor to extend my stipend until August so yes, it would have been a different story if I've been sitting around without anything for a while!

Hey, it sounds GREAT to me, but I might just be frugal and used to making peanuts.

They really should be paying your expenses Cherub - the interview I attended did and so did those of my friends. But yes, go anyway, the experience is worth it