Hi everyone. Are any of you undertaking a PhD or DPhil for pleasure? Am mature (well, very mature!), have just completed a Masters and considering should I continue with a doc. Idea appeals, I do like researching, but is this enough to get me through? Any advice?

I think it's good.

However, be prepared for the pleasure to somewhat disappear througout the research period.

Golf's fun if you've got time on your hands and you're looking for a hobby.

I think it is an excellent idea. But as the previous poster says the pleasure derived does wax and wane somewhat.

Pleasure isn't my primary motivation though since I do want a academic career. I suppose when doing a PhD for pleasure it is important to remember that the demands of a PhD are not those of a hobby. The PhD has to fit particular formats and be completed with rigour in a defined space of time. Not a totally relaxing pastime!

Yes - the only problem there is how to keep going when it isn't pleasurable. And that will probably happen. If I didn't want to work in this field I don't think the pleasure would see me through the tedium/worry/panic/pressure/hard work.

Thanks for your messages. Yes I know it will be hard work/frustrating/panicky etc but have been through all that over the past year or two doing a distance Masters. Self-direct and without much support. How would you compare research Masters & PhD?
By the way, would go crazy chasing a little ball into a tiny hole. Much more exhilarating to search and find out things - also keeps me sane and the mind occupied.

I think the slumps are bigger with PhD - a masters, even over 2 years, is more intense and has more momentum. I am doing this mainly for pleasure in that I'm also a mature student from another profession and not at all certain to get a job after this. But it has been hard going and I think, frankly, if I weren't funded I would not have continued. Perhpas you should do it for pleasure but also entertain the idea of doing something more with it afterwards. After all - what will you do for pleasure then...?

Why, or in what way are slumps bigger Smilodon? Was your Masters/previous degree taught, or self directed. Could make a difference.

I think what my colleague Smilodon is trying to say is that a PhD takes a long time. For this reason, bad times are longer as well, making it more difficult to see the light. In fact, it could easily be the case that you don't see any light for three years or longer. That's somewhat hard to handle because it's not just yourself struggling but the world around you moves on and they simply don't understand what it's like, hence increasing the pressure and making it even worse. It's hard to explain but it's very, very, tough to do a PhD. As other's have said, it's a marathon but I prefer to call it a torture process.

It was half & half over one year so it was quite intense. I guess if you're doing it for pleasure you might not feel the same pressure that many of us do - but then again - I think the pressure is actually a necessary evil.

It's not that I think you shouldn't do it - I just think you might need a more motivating framework than you have had so far. But that's probably because I would. The pressure this year is pretty intense and I need more of a goal than the pleasurable moments to keep me going.

I think the previous comments make the point well - and I am sure you have considered all of this - but there is really no way to prepare for what a PhD is like -

It not all that bad - but it is very different to what you might expect (even having done the masters). Personally I found the first year quite enjoyable and the following two much harder.

I think that particularly when it gets difficult and you are doing it for pleasure you may find times where you question what your real goals are.

If you look at numerous other threads you'll see reems of 'Help' messages from people considering dropping out - and I'm sure they are from a mix of mature students as well as freshly graduated students.

In my own opinion, regardless of how well you think you know what you are in for, it is just something you have to do to find out.

Your love for research will help you through but it takes a lot of willpower too.

All the best

S

Am beginning to get a picture of what it might be like. Or am I? Plenty of and 'why did I ever start this' 'I'm getting nowhere' etc. But how many of you working for(or your friends who have completed)the PhD really regret taking it on? Is it worth it in the end - or will be, inspite of all the frustrations, boring bits, lack of confidence, etc etc.
I know I have plenty of willpower and determination (advantage of mature years over you guys?!!!) which you said was essential, sjo4.

I think very few people who complete the PhD regret it afterward

I think the drop out rate is very low compared to masters and degree levels

I'm within reaching distance of the end, and despite the frustration and boredom couldn't be happier

If The PhD is something you are passionate about and want to do, you will probably already know that you are going to do it with or without our advice.

Just make sure you make the right choice of PhD, supervisor and make plenty of PhD friends when you start - these are all essential for completing a PhD with intact sanity

Good Luck

S

Much appreciate your words of encouragement sj04. Very surprised that the dropout rate is lower for PhDs. For curiosity sake, any figures on this? Have taken on board your advice re choices, particularly of supervisor and other PhD students. Having had a bad experience in past with supervisor, and not knowing other similar students, don't want to go through this again.
Best of luck finishing yours.