Hi folks,

want to start a (potentially) helpful game?

Let's note down the steps that happen for us, as we move from point A (an idea) to point B (a finished draft, revised and ready for submission).

The idea is, we all post our writing paths, and make notes from others, as appropriate and get to share what works for us (or not).

I'll start off with my 10 steps: (written keeping in mind something like an essay/article)

1. The idea, some thinking
2. A search through key things in relevant literature, prints and PDFs in a folder
3. A day or two to read/skim through, plus brush through 'core' readings
4. Return to idea: prepare a sketch on paper/pen of the flow/narrative
5. Rough draft (this happens v v fast for me, and then I slowwww down)
6. Chisel, move around
7. check for 5 to 7 key steps in the argument. match intro and conclusion.
8. show someone/s trustworthy
9. revise/rechisel as appropriate
10. Submit

I've written peer-reviewed journal papers but my main focus during the PhD has been on writing thesis chapters, so I'd prefer to answer from that perspective, especially since I've almost finished and am glad it's behind me! The process was much more tortuous than I expected. Obviously there has to be the research done, either before or alongside the writing. Only with research do I have something worth writing about. And then that leads to ...

1. Think about structure, scribble down lots of notes and rough ideas/brainstorm
2. Start with the intro (don't know why: I always want to start with the start, even if I deviate after)
3. Then start picking off the sections based on which I feel more like writing a bit
4. Repeat 3 until I've finished all the sections
5. Print out and scribble all over with a red pen to edit majorly
6. Make revisions. Spell check
7. Send to supervisors and get feedback back months later. Ouch. Writing style has to totally change
8. So total rewrite. Mega ouch! Spell check again
9. Send off to supervisors again. Get more trivial feedback. Draw up list of things to fix
10. Rewrite again, though less painfully. End up with complete thesis draft. Combine chapters into 1 document. Spell check again
11. Send off to supervisors. Again wait months for feedback. Final revisions suggested, based on total argument etc.
12. Rewrite for the last time
13. Submit!

It's a very prolonged process and the worst bit was the writing style being so bad. In the end I've gone through 5 main writing phases in my thesis production: early rough chapter versions including literature review, first proper go at chapters, then have to rewrite majorly so here we go again, then rewrite after less critical feedback, and finally rewrite after supervisors see the full draft. And supervisors can take many months to send feedback (even though I'm part-time time is an issue), so it takes *ages*. Not much fun.

Mine is also for the thesis:-
1. get an idea of what is going into the chapter
2. get some post-its and write some headings covering the areas I think I should be including, stick on a board in some kind of order
3. get some books that looks like they might have something in, go to journal search engine and find (hopefully)some journals, print these out. -for some chapters documents will be the main source of information. make sure I put all of these in my references NOW
(at this stage I think things are going well :$)
4. put sub headings into chapter based on post-its, adding to these as I go along. Have yet to set up the final master document properly, but use the sub headings in preparation
5. Have a quick look through books and journals and find bits that look as though they might fit in chapters, write these on more post-its and stick on others so i have an idea what goes where. Read those books which look promising as major contributors, read documents etc. write some notes on these.
6. start writing using headings as a guide and delving into books etc for the quotes that match up with what I'm writing.
7. Try to get the whole chapter into some kind of shape before I start editing, fleshing it out etc.
8. print out a copy and read it, try not to wince too much at the grammar, spelling etc.
:-(, send for books that appear quite often in these books that are not in the library - I manage to get one really cheap from amazon that was nearly £50 new, that was a good day!
9. write new draft by moving bits around having renamed document to keep original.
repeat 8 and 9 until it looks reasonable adding more refs and bits as I go along
10. send to supervisor
11. correct using comments of supervisor etc. jiggle it around and then add proper intro and conclusion.
12. feel it is OK, but have to poke it every so often, just so I don't get too complacent about it and add bits when I find things in other places.
I guess there will be more revision before I'm finally happy with it, at the moment I feel that its never going to get there!

This is a very helpful game! I've done one draft of a chapter and was supposed to send my second draft to my supervisor this evening but haven't changed anything much. However I have post its and books with stickers in and articles with highlighted sections and paper with ideas on all waiting to go in the second draft. I have a panel coming up and I know that I won't have a perfect chapter by then. I was worrying about how I write but it seems that I do the same as the other posters which has reassured me that I am making progress and it will all come together properly eventually. Thanks.

Hmm, so far, generally we all seem to have three main phases: first: idea, gathering stuff, writing some draft, second: post review massive reaarangement and revisions, and third: chiseling, fine tuning, fiddling around and submission....

:-)

Like it, like it a lot, v useful (up)

This is a brilliant thread, Bug; I'd give you ten stars if I could!

======= Date Modified 07 Sep 2009 19:05:19 =======
Oh eska I love you :-)



Just out of a meeting on the pan European project thing I work on. And I heard this sentence, as people sat and brainstormed the nth version of a uqestionnaire and made an *immediate* note to come and share with you guys...



"Remember, when you are chiseling a draft for the 7th and 8th time, implementing all your desired revisions, sometimes you are so focused by then on whats ON the page that you have lost sight of what's never been on the page... '



i.e. that's the time to take a break, send it to someone else, go off and do something different and come back to see 3 things you never thought you wanted but which makes it all look so much better...i.e. when you are too used to it, dont submit it...take a break from it so that it gives you fresh perspectives (or not)..



an interesting thing I thought for we have all been writing linear stories of how we get about doing this...similar stuff from us all, and this bit in between is a nice break!

I got four stars!!!!!!!!!!!! ohhhhh yeahahhhh!!!!(up):p:$:-x8-):-)

OK, here's how I do it:

1. I have a rough idea of the point I want to make; what my aim is.

2. If the piece is building on something else, I insert useful pre-writen sections in what I think is the relevant order.

3. I try to decide which bit I should start writing first, and if I can't think of a logical reason (what usually happens) I start wrting about whatever is firing me up the most.

3. I keep writing for days, sometimes a couple of weeks, until I have something approaching a suitable first draft.

4. I leave it for a couple of days.

5. I read through what I've written and see what is emerging as the central thread of the writing, what is geling it together.

6. I then edit out bits I don't want to use - this could mean losing half of what I've done so far, but I always save it for possible later use.

7. I decide what I need to say in order to complete the piece - then I write it; this is usually much quicker than the earlier bit of writing.

8. I redraft many times, ideally leaving a couple of days between each major redraft, but realistically, I often do it in a panic right up until the deadline for sending to my supervisor.

9. Meet with the supervisor and thrash it out in terms of writing and strength of argument - learn loads, and realise how much I could improve it.

10. Re-write in light of the above, this will take several drafts.

I haven't written a chapter yet, so this could be an early days writing process for me - only time will tell.

Excellent thread - thanks for this :-)

I seem to work much the same way as the rest of you - this is my standard procedure for essays/chapters etc

1. get an idea and ponder on it for a while
2. get the main reading together, journals, articles, books, etc
3. revise my argument (it always seems to happen)
4. prepare a rough outline - headings/ideas within the headings/location of key arguments and quotes
5. I always begin at the beginning - without a basic intro I can't get going
6. write a draft of the various points within the chapter including quotes/data etc (not always written in order - I find a blank piece of paper hard to work with so after the intro I'll start on the bit I find easiest and take it from there
7. put completed draft to one side for a few days and I'll normally show it to somebody who is able to see the typos/contradictions that I miss
8. revise the draft - rewrite sections - hack hack hack back to the good stuff (always well over word limits)
9. send to my supervisor for initial comments
10. act on the comments and pretty up the whole thing ensuring the argument flows well and makes sense
11. submit

All of this can get a bit muddled up sometimes - I'll think of a quote or an argument during the write up and spend ages reading again to find the details that I need. I'll also sometimes write and correct at the same time - this normally only happens in longer pieces where there are readily defined sections - I'll have a break from writing by going over an earlier section that has sat for a few days. But that's the normal progression

======= Date Modified 09 Sep 2009 10:13:56 =======
============= Edited by a Moderator =============
-Removed- Advertising

You are sad. But why did you come and spoil this lovely thread? WOuldnt your stupid ad have attracted more attention, albeit swear words with it, if you made a separate thread out of it???

Urrgh. You are so sad.